The General Politics Thread

traptunderice

emperorblackdoom wrote
^^The USA could take a few cues from this.

Because crime would just be eliminated without immigrants?

Maybe I'm dumb but what constitutes a foreigner in Swissland, visa, illegal im', citizen but not by birth what is that a naturalized citizen or something?

Heidegger/Arendt have killed the practical issues side of my brain. I can only speak about generalities of the social and political, everydayness and inauthenticity.

I like that Frig said "oh dear god" because old frig would've been like "yeah, get the mozlems out of my yard".

North_From_Here

Goat wrote
What, the Swiss far right?

Yes, the cue being a tougher stance on foreign criminals.

However, the White Sheep/Black Sheep flag thing is in very poor taste, ala Tea Party signs comparing Obama to Hitler.

North_From_Here

traptunderice wrote
emperorblackdoom wrote
^^The USA could take a few cues from this.
Because crime would just be eliminated without immigrants?Maybe I'm dumb but what constitutes a foreigner in Swissland, visa, illegal im', citizen but not by birth what is that a naturalized citizen or something?Heidegger/Arendt have killed the practical issues side of my brain. I can only speak about generalities of the social and political, everydayness and inauthenticity.I like that Frig said "oh dear god" because old frig would've been like "yeah, get the mozlems out of my yard".

Class Identity+Ethnic Identity=Societal Strife
I can't see a lens of one without the other working for societal analysis.

My brain is mush now as well, the article does beg the questions you are asking about 'foreigners' in Switzerland.

C_Chulainn

I said "oh god" because I don't know whether to be proud or ashamed. On the one hand, if that percentage of crime really is being committed by foreigners, than why the hell give them the advantages of hospitality, especially in a time of recession? On the other hand, what the fuck? You can't just expel people. Or can you? What's constitutional? What's against human rights?
I would have been more comfortable had they accepted the counter proposal, which was expulsion for any crime where a jail sentence for a swiss citizen would last more than 2 years, unless expulsion would entail sending someone back to a country where torture or execution is legal.

traptunderice

emperorblackdoom wrote
traptunderice wrote
emperorblackdoom wrote
^^The USA could take a few cues from this.
Because crime would just be eliminated without immigrants?Maybe I'm dumb but what constitutes a foreigner in Swissland, visa, illegal im', citizen but not by birth what is that a naturalized citizen or something?Heidegger/Arendt have killed the practical issues side of my brain. I can only speak about generalities of the social and political, everydayness and inauthenticity.I like that Frig said "oh dear god" because old frig would've been like "yeah, get the mozlems out of my yard".
Class Identity+Ethnic Identity=Societal StrifeI can't see a lens of one without the other working for societal analysis.

Maybe you're trying to say more but just looking at that equation, something isn't kosher. Being poor and pissed off is fine. Being black and pissed off is fine but being poor and black is bad? I'll make the Sartrean/Fanonian/Marxist claim that you can only develop consciousness in recognition of an Other, of realizing one's place within a struggle, of discovering oppression through seeing the lot of your fellow in comparison to those who are not you, i.e., the bourgeois. Identity is always created through comparison and conflict so I don't see how two identities create strife. On that note, revolution would only arise when race and class are taken up as causes? Maybe you meant something else and I just ranted off topic.

Goat

FrigidSymphony wrote
unless expulsion would entail sending someone back to a country where torture or execution is legal.

That's the kicker, for me. Glad that our government has stopped this.

So does the US not deport foreign people when they commit crimes, then?

traptunderice

Goat wrote
FrigidSymphony wrote
unless expulsion would entail sending someone back to a country where torture or execution is legal.
That's the kicker, for me. Glad that our government has stopped this.So does the US not deport foreign people when they commit crimes, then?

Don't think so.

Kathaarian

I wonder if the wikileaks thing caused as much trouble anywhere else as it did in Turkey. It literally caused a political earthquake. The news have been about nothing else but these files for days. The government is having to take serious shit from all over, especially the parliament.

Assange is a fucking hero, that's what he is.

traptunderice

I haven't heard anything about it over here but I hope documents will expose corporations for being the rat-bastards they are soon enough.

Goat

This is the best thing to come out of the whole thing -

<a class="postlink" href="http://www.nzherald.co.nz/technology/news/article.cfm?c_id=5&objectid=10691548&ref=twitter">http://www.nzherald.co.nz/technology/ne ... ef=twitter</a>
<a class="postlink" href="http://twitter.com/Julian_Ass">http://twitter.com/Julian_Ass</a>

North_From_Here

traptunderice wrote
emperorblackdoom wrote
traptunderice wrote
emperorblackdoom wrote
^^The USA could take a few cues from this.
Because crime would just be eliminated without immigrants?Maybe I'm dumb but what constitutes a foreigner in Swissland, visa, illegal im', citizen but not by birth what is that a naturalized citizen or something?Heidegger/Arendt have killed the practical issues side of my brain. I can only speak about generalities of the social and political, everydayness and inauthenticity.I like that Frig said "oh dear god" because old frig would've been like "yeah, get the mozlems out of my yard".
Class Identity+Ethnic Identity=Societal StrifeI can't see a lens of one without the other working for societal analysis.
Maybe you're trying to say more but just looking at that equation, something isn't kosher. Being poor and pissed off is fine. Being black and pissed off is fine but being poor and black is bad? I'll make the Sartrean/Fanonian/Marxist claim that you can only develop consciousness in recognition of an Other, of realizing one's place within a struggle, of discovering oppression through seeing the lot of your fellow in comparison to those who are not you, i.e., the bourgeois. Identity is always created through comparison and conflict so I don't see how two identities create strife. On that note, revolution would only arise when race and class are taken up as causes? Maybe you meant something else and I just ranted off topic.

I did mean something else, I did like your rant though. Whereas some on the far left would only see class difference and some on the far right would only see ethnic difference as the fundamental ailment for society, I see two components to societal strife, the class difference and the ethnic difference pathway. Determining the relationship between seems to be the key. Surely there are numerous case studies emphasizing the primacy of one over the other; I'll have to get reading on those...whenever I have the time.

traptunderice

Umm yeah I completely agree with race + class equaling strife. Add gender into that and you have the women's studies 101 concept of intersectionality. Yeah, all prejudices have a degree of some form of others there are more than just the three I've mention but yeah. Oppression is always multi-faceted.

North_From_Here

traptunderice wrote
Umm yeah I completely agree with race + class equaling strife. Add gender into that and you have the women's studies 101 concept of intersectionality. Yeah, all prejudices have a degree of some form of others there are more than just the three I've mention but yeah. Oppression is always multi-faceted.

Right, the question is which element is the primary one. Is there a historical pattern out there? Or is every case study going to go its own way.

I know what E. P. Thompson would say and I know what Samuel Huntington would say :lol: :lol:

traptunderice

emperorblackdoom wrote
I know what E. P. Thompson would say and I know what Samuel Huntington would say :lol: :lol:

True. I say economic because there is something that just seems so intrinsic to those issues which almost always plays into how gender and race issues are problematized.

Samuel Huntington always just seems so superficial to say these people don't like each other because of cultural or racial distinctions when you can look into the conflict and find material conditions that play into what is going on.

Goat

Am I the only one who thinks that Assange might actually be a rapist?

traptunderice

Goat wrote
Am I the only one who thinks that Assange might actually be a rapist?

no. doesn't he have kinda alot of evidence against him?

C_Chulainn

There's jackshit evidence against him, Zad, you know this. The sex was consensual, no way he's a rapist.

Kathaarian

He was not found guilty of anything, no? Then he is innocent.

noodles

He got arrested today and might get extradited to face charges.

He has been wanted on an Interpol arrest warrant stemming from a Swedish criminal charge based on having consensual sex without a condom. The charge, known as "sex by surprise" in Sweden, is punishable by a fine of about $715. His accuser has ties to a Cuban anti-Castro group that's been partially funded by the CIA in the past.

lol

Goat

FrigidSymphony wrote
There's jackshit evidence against him, Zad, you know this. The sex was consensual, no way he's a rapist.

You know we're not talking about Polanski, right? :wink:

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