Metal Reviews

Me too. Although I enjoy Spaced, so both were good.

You're welcome.

I don't buy any mags except Terrorizer, but I read nearly everything off the shelves in borders.

The only video nasty that was a zombie film was Zombie Flesh Eaters, unless you count Evil Dead. I think, at least... I'll have to check. But seeing as how the modern zombie horror was spawned with Night of the Living Dead, it's bizarre to claim that the genre only took of through BBFC notoriety.

Incidentally, the best zomedy ever made is Peter Jackson's Braindead. If you haven't seen it, do so. I'm not kidding: That film changed the way I think about art and life in general.

I broadened it to include the extreme horror genre as a whole. Underground cult films not really any good elevated to godhood through notoriety.

Hmm.

Au contraire. The only films which were genuinely helped to godhood through notoriety are those such as Evil Dead, Texas Chainsaw Massacre... You think these are bad? :shock: On the other hand Zombie Flesh Eaters is a film that's equal to those two but remains critically underrated- despite it's video nasty status. People prefer to think of it as a Dawn ripoff, which makes you wonder whether they've actually seen it. the same could be said about Last House on the Left.

And the Cannibal Holocaust series? You can't tell me that's art. I still think this is hypocritical, this wanting extremity but shying away from what is really extreme.

I've been into Korean movies lately.... its really good. Much better than Hollywood infact, you guys should hunt them down.

I recommend stuff like Old Boy, Chingu, and Fighter In The Wind !

Apparently Visitor Q 's quite a laugh.

Cannibal Holocaust ain't a zombie film (if that was your point :? ).

a) Cannibal Holocaust has artistic merit. Have you actually seen it? It actually makes quite a few pretty astute observations about sensationalist journalism. It was original, and even by todays standards the "found footage" style is inventive. People thought the style used in Blair Witch Project was unique? Cannibal Holocaust predates it by over a decade.

b) You're saying that because some underground horror films suck, that condemns the entire genre? Discounting all the good stuff there? If you like romcoms and you list some good ones, then I say "But sliding doors was shit", does that discount your argument?

c) We've already discussed extremity in this very thread. So you like grim and necro music, Zad? Do you enjoy listening to live recordings of people actually suffering? Thought not, you fucking pussy!

recently..."The Aristocrats" and "Dead and Breakfast"...The Aristocrats isn't what I expected at all so I was fairly disappointed however Dead and Breakfast was fairly original and I found it thoroughly enjoyable.

A) I haven't, and sensational journalism doesn't really do it for me. It just seems tacky to me, in a teenage sort of 'let's shock the parents!' way. I didn't find Blair Witch that amazing. The long-haired witch guy on the extras was quite creepy, though.

B) Well, I'm the world's biggest fan of rom-coms, so you completely got me there. Sliding Doors was probably my favourite film EVER.

C) Only to a point. I like some, sometimes, but not just because it's nekro and grim. On the other hand, we have horror, which is surely all about the "horror" itself. So going OTT there is more acceptable as far as that goes. And you're really forgetting our goregrind argument, aren't you?

Yes, Rad, I'm not completely flipping mental. I realised that Cannibal Holocaust wasn't about zombies.

a) So... you're telling me it has no artistic merit, based on what? If you haven't seen it how could you be in a position to make that kind of judgement? You do realise I said it was a comment about sensationalist journalism, don't you? Your post implied that you interpreted what I said as "This film is a sensational piece of journalism".

b) So you're being facetious because you realised what a ridiculous idea it was to dismiss an entire genre based on one film that you've never seen?

c) You like grimness in music "Only to a point". Yet you're criticising me for not going all the way with cinematic grimness? Do I detect double standards?

I hope you don't mind me saying so, Zad, but if you want to argue about this kind of thing you should know your subject matter a little better

a) Based on the fact it's about cannibals. Are you watching for the intellectual subplots? Are you hell, you're watching it for the gore. Sicko.

b) Not just that film! Horror films fall into two catagories for me:

1. Shitty new Hollwood ones.
2. Shitty old over-rated ones.

And when I see one of these uber-krieg Japanese ones, I'll let you know. Audition looks cool... but even then I'm not expecting much.

c) With music, grimness isn't the whole point. There is more to BM than that (or I think so, anyway). What possible other excuse is there for horror films?

I'll have a go anyway, Mr Dario-Argento's-My-Father-In-Law.

a) If I watched films like that purely for sickness and violence my shelves would be full of movies like Cannibal Ferox, Faces of Death, etc... As it stands, they're not. If you think that's all there is to underground horror then you need to broaden your mind a bit!

b) 1. Agreed
2. Name me some films you've seen that fit this description, then I can start to put more credibility in your value judgements

c) Most horror films have more to them than grimness. The ones that don't are usually weaker, but then who says you should judge an art form on its poorest, most derivative entries? You do, apparently! Some have humour, some have tension. Some are even socially aware. The films I like purely because of grim atmosphere are those that realise that ambiance is just as valid an objective in cinema as excitement.

You'd better give me a list of ones to watch. Not promising anything, mind.

Will do tonight when I'm not at work

Tease.

Well, here are 5 of my favourite films I think you should watch at some point. None of them are really "extreme or underground" though, but if you think these suck then there's no point continuing.

1. Suspiria- Maybe one of my top 2-3 films ever. If you ever get the chance to see it, make sure the volume is turned right up, and the lights are out. Dario has the ambition to use an astonishing noise/prog soundtrack and surreal coloured lighting to an extent that no other director would dare. It's almost like a fairytale: The shots of a girl running through a forest in the middle of the night with streaming rain and the atonal ear shredding soundtrack is atmosphere like you've never experienced at the cinema. This is the only Argento film that could really be described as "genius". Get used to the shit dubbing- it's well worth it if you can overlook it.

2. Braindead- Simultaneously one of the goriest and one of the funniest films ever made. Really has to be seen to be believed how much comedy excess is in this film.

3. Evil Dead 2- Better than the first one, but you may need to see that to set the scene. Probably the most iconic acting performance in horror from Bruce Campbell. The movie revolves around him parodying, but simultaneously becoming even more awesome than any action hero you've ever seen. A lot of slapstick, but at the same time a very grim, creepy atmosphere.

4. Zombie Flesh Eaters- Flawed by the mindless plotting and dialogue, but the best zombie makeup ever, and probably the most oppressive and plague ridden ambiance that I've ever seen in a film. The zombie vs shark scene is just... bizarre.

5. Switchblade Romance- By far the most recent... The first half is a total masterclass in tension-building. It's genuinely fucking scary, which is saying a lot. Also very brutal and pretty uncomprimising. Sadly the twist at the end is too clever for it's own good, and ends up just being stupid.

To be honest I just enjoy talking about this kind of thing, I don't expect you to go out and search for any of these It's just that nobody ever asks me these kind of questions in the real world so I like to go in depth when I have the chance. :oops: I'm just saying, they're all pretty well known films that could be a good introduction to this very broad genre- so if any of your friends already owns one of them, borrow it!

Switchblade Romance and Suspiria I've heard of. Will have a look when I get back to Manchester, which won't be for a while, but I'll let you know what I think (if I bother...). Not really got the facilities to watch anything in Shitstown.

Never quite bought into the hype around this. Some of its good, some of its just exruciating. And what kind of maternal issues does Peter Jackson suffer from, really?



This one I do like, but the first was better IMO. Bruce really does give a masterclass in hurting oneself, though.


Real actor...in full zombie make up....punching out a live shark!