Evanescence - The Open Door (#3568)

Antonakis · **Posted:** Thu Dec 07, 2006 11:18 pm

Brahm_K wrote:

It doesn't mean more praise, but it does mean that even here, more attention is paid to bands the majority of people seem to dislike than to bands nobody's heard of who deserve the praise. I too have gotten involved in these things; but discussions like this are nearly the same for every review and never end up actually accomplishing anything, like a discussion should.

Yeah, I know what you mean and I agree on that. Unfortunately there's not much we can do, it's kind of natural... :sad:

Cú Chulainn · **Posted:** Thu Dec 07, 2006 11:18 pm

Brahm_K wrote:

Antonakis wrote:

Brahm_K wrote:

Goddamnit, how is it that Evanescence and Disturbed threads always get more posts than good bands?

What does this have to do with anything ? More posts don't more more praise. On top of that, here we had a multi-level argument spanning several pages of relatively subjective views with a discussion provoking review as a background. It's common with popular (not necessarily good) bands.

It doesn't mean more praise, but it does mean that even here, more attention is paid to bands the majority of people seem to dislike than to bands nobody's heard of who deserve the praise. I too have gotten involved in these things; but discussions like this are nearly the same for every review and never end up actually accomplishing anything, like a discussion should.

yeah, but we can't go on saying how great a band is for 10 pages, can we?

Eyesore · **Posted:** Thu Dec 07, 2006 11:57 pm

derncare wrote:

Yes, musicians do grow and change. My favorite genres have changed a dozen times in my life, but if you honestly believe the industry has nothing to do with alot of changes undergone by bands, you are just in denial. You don't think Metallica hired Bob "Bon Jovi" Rock to become more accessible? Label pressure had alot to do with Annihilator's Set the World on Fire in the early 90s. Dream Theater admittedly conformed too much on Falling into Infinity to get sales up....etc...etc...etc...

No way. I completely agree with you; I simply think that the amount of bands really doing this are few and far between in the grand scheme of things. I think most bands who're labeled "sell outs" really aren't; they just evolved into something different. When bands change, and fans can't make that journey with them, the band is labeled a "sell out." I think 9 out of 10 times that perception is wrong.

derncare · **Joined:** Sat Jul 16, 2005 4:40 am **Posts:** 731

Eyesore wrote:

derncare wrote:

Yes, musicians do grow and change. My favorite genres have changed a dozen times in my life, but if you honestly believe the industry has nothing to do with alot of changes undergone by bands, you are just in denial. You don't think Metallica hired Bob "Bon Jovi" Rock to become more accessible? Label pressure had alot to do with Annihilator's Set the World on Fire in the early 90s. Dream Theater admittedly conformed too much on Falling into Infinity to get sales up....etc...etc...etc...

No way. I completely agree with you; I simply think that the amount of bands really doing this are few and far between in the grand scheme of things. I think most bands who're labeled "sell outs" really aren't; they just evolved into something different. When bands change, and fans can't make that journey with them, the band is labeled a "sell out." I think 9 out of 10 times that perception is wrong.

I agree that it's less bands than alot of people claim because many people call any change selling out. Not every change in personality is a sell out. What's funny is that when a band never changes, the same people will accuse them of being stagnant :lol:

I think there are alot of bands that sold out in some way, but I don't even necessarily believe they are all completely bad. It's not as if DT's Falling into Infinity was devoid of any good songs. I just apparently think this happens more overall than you do.

MetalWizard · **Joined:** Fri Nov 24, 2006 5:04 pm **Posts:** 75

I personally really enjoy Dream Theater's "Falling Into Infinity"

Great CD!

derncare · **Joined:** Sat Jul 16, 2005 4:40 am **Posts:** 731

MetalWizard wrote:

I personally really enjoy Dream Theater's "Falling Into Infinity"

Great CD!

I like it too. I just know DT said it wasn't exactly "their" album because they were under pressure to make it more accessible.

Eyesore · **Posted:** Fri Dec 08, 2006 3:10 am

derncare wrote:

I agree that it's less bands than alot of people claim because many people call any change selling out. Not every change in personality is a sell out. What's funny is that when a band never changes, the same people will accuse them of being stagnant :lol:

I know! Catch-22. A band changes and people complain that they're sellouts; they don't change and people complain that they don't change. Hahaha.

Like Black Label Society, everyone complains that Zakk releases the same album year after year. Yet no one seems to appreciate that Zakk releases an album pretty much every single year! How can you not like that? Yes, album to album there's not much evolution so people whine and complain; but compare Shot To Hell to Sonic Brew and they're two completely different kinds of albums! No one seems to acknowledge this. Now, imagine if Zakk had released Shot To Hell right after Sonic Brew; he would have been slammed for selling out. :lame:

Quote:

I think there are alot of bands that sold out in some way, but I don't even necessarily believe they are all completely bad. It's not as if DT's Falling into Infinity was devoid of any good songs. I just apparently think this happens more overall than you do.

Labels have a lot of influence on bands. You think the label would have been happy with the new Evanescence album if "Call Me When You're Sober" wasn't on it? That's the clear-cut lead-off single. There is no other guaranteed radio-friendly track on the album. Labels often influence bands to write a song like "Call Me When You're Sober" with the threat—overt or subtle—of not releasing the album until they produce that "hit." An unfortunate side effect of the music business.

Some bands write a song or two to appease the label; some bands do the entire album this way. The latter is the band I consider to be the true sellouts; the former just do what has to be done.

noodles · **Posted:** Fri Dec 08, 2006 4:01 am

Generally people want the band to change while still making music that was just as good as their older material (Dark Tranquillity, Neurosis) or stay the same while still being interesting (Nevermore, Converge)...

Ness · **Posted:** Fri Dec 08, 2006 4:37 am

Antonakis wrote:

FrigidSymphony wrote:

I dislike female fronted bands. Female voices just don't work. Or it might be that most female fronted bands tend towards a genre I don't really care for, female fronted or not.

Totally agree. Maybe I'm narrow-minded but rock and metal music have settled in my brain with guy singing even if he's singing like a soprano. I just can't make myself like female fronted bands. There have been a few occasional exceptions ofcourse like White Skull and Ayreon's females but not too many.

Dark Moor's ex-singer Elisa Martin is good. Otherwise yes, chick singers are poopy.

Eyesore · **Posted:** Fri Dec 08, 2006 4:47 am

metalNESS wrote:

Antonakis wrote:

FrigidSymphony wrote:

I dislike female fronted bands. Female voices just don't work. Or it might be that most female fronted bands tend towards a genre I don't really care for, female fronted or not.

Totally agree. Maybe I'm narrow-minded but rock and metal music have settled in my brain with guy singing even if he's singing like a soprano. I just can't make myself like female fronted bands. There have been a few occasional exceptions ofcourse like White Skull and Ayreon's females but not too many.

Dark Moor's ex-singer Elisa Martin is good. Otherwise yes, chick singers are poopy.

Chick singers KO1 male singers who sound like chick singers.

noodles · **Posted:** Fri Dec 08, 2006 4:51 am

Eyesore wrote:

metalNESS wrote:

Antonakis wrote:

FrigidSymphony wrote:

I dislike female fronted bands. Female voices just don't work. Or it might be that most female fronted bands tend towards a genre I don't really care for, female fronted or not.

Totally agree. Maybe I'm narrow-minded but rock and metal music have settled in my brain with guy singing even if he's singing like a soprano. I just can't make myself like female fronted bands. There have been a few occasional exceptions ofcourse like White Skull and Ayreon's females but not too many.

Dark Moor's ex-singer Elisa Martin is good. Otherwise yes, chick singers are poopy.

Chick singers KO1 male singers who sound like chick singers.

www.myspace.com/circasurvive ?

I'm still waiting for a band who has really good music and a female singer but all I've found is Hammers of Misfortune's new album and To-Mera.

Eyesore · **Posted:** Fri Dec 08, 2006 5:09 am

noodles wrote:

I'm still waiting for a band who has really good music and a female singer but all I've found is Hammers of Misfortune's new album and To-Mera.

Pretty dumb comment, bro.

Cú Chulainn · **Posted:** Fri Dec 08, 2006 12:49 pm

It's funny though, because all the chick fronted bands i've heard were more towards the gothy side of metal. But I like Lullacry's singer! Is that because Lullacry isn't goth?

thedirtyporthole · **Posted:** Fri Dec 08, 2006 3:10 pm

It took me a while after getting into metal to be able to deal with a female singer in a metal band. it just didnt work for me. Now, though there are a few that i enjoy listening to. The singer from Madder Mortem is pretty sick. SHe is probably the best of the bunch in my opinion.

MetalWizard · **Joined:** Fri Nov 24, 2006 5:04 pm **Posts:** 75

FrigidSymphony wrote:

It's funny though, because all the chick fronted bands i've heard were more towards the gothy side of metal. But I like Lullacry's singer! Is that because Lullacry isn't goth?

I like Lullacry alot. I feel that there are a good amount of female fronted bands that create fantastic music. The problem is that when a genre becomes popular you then have a huge glut of copy-cat bands that really should not have attempted the endevour at all.

It kimd of reminds me of the late 80's. There were a few really good "hair" bands and then the record companies signed anyone who looked and sounds the part because they knew people would buy it.

The bottom line for me is this.......

I say listen to what you like and to hell with everyone else.

Radagast · **Posted:** Fri Dec 08, 2006 3:53 pm

noodles wrote:

Generally people want the band to change while still making music that was just as good as their older material (Dark Tranquillity, Neurosis) or stay the same while still being interesting (Nevermore, Converge)...

Yup.

rio · **Posted:** Fri Dec 08, 2006 4:02 pm

Eyesore wrote:

noodles wrote:

I'm still waiting for a band who has really good music and a female singer but all I've found is Hammers of Misfortune's new album and To-Mera.

Pretty dumb comment, bro.

Hells yes, noodles you suck!

leee · **Posted:** Fri Dec 08, 2006 9:10 pm

FrigidSymphony wrote:

I dislike female fronted bands. Female voices just don't work. Or it might be that most female fronted bands tend towards a genre I don't really care for, female fronted or not.

Sonata Arctica is female fronted.....

Ness · **Posted:** Fri Dec 08, 2006 9:22 pm

leee wrote:

FrigidSymphony wrote:

I dislike female fronted bands. Female voices just don't work. Or it might be that most female fronted bands tend towards a genre I don't really care for, female fronted or not.

Sonata Arctica is female fronted.....

So is half the genre.

derncare · **Joined:** Sat Jul 16, 2005 4:40 am **Posts:** 731

How about the chick who used to sing for Angra and Sha(a)man? :lol:

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Evanescence - The Open Door (#3568)

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