Metal Reviews

And if you think that strict gun control is going to slow down or eliminate gun deaths or crimes than my friend I'd like to sell you some ocean front land in the Australian Outback to ya.

Get rid of the Second Amendment... ok still a shitload of guns floating around... ok so only criminals have them... ok now waht?... the law abiding citizens are defenseless...sounds like a brilliant plan.

Are you really that fucking dense?

Like I said, stick to cricket and gettng falling down drunk, clown.
Let us that live here deal with our own reality.

fuck this asshat, another waste of bandwidth, it turns out.

No it's just that you.. what was it you said before... oh yeah:



replace "scottish" with "aussie" and there you go.

And regarding your whiny bitch ass rant about Americans... a lot of hard talk from behind a keyboard doesn't impress me much.. just don't forget not to make eye contact with the local "bikie" gangs...

you're the one who started slinging insults after I simply stated my opinion mate, wake the fuck up and realise that just because we aren't American this does not preclude us from having opinions on certain American issues

obviously your head is so far up your own ass you can't understand the difference between someone's critique of the US and someone (such as myself) who was fishing for a reaction

then again given many people around here tend to hurl insults at each other perhaps it is a little difficult to tell when someone is offering serious opinions and when they aren't

tell you what from now on I'll add a smiley to any post where I'm just taking the piss

back to the subject of politics I personally wish Australia had a bill of rights similar to that of the US to protect fundamental freedoms, there are only three rights enshrined in the Australian Constitution, right to freedom of association, right to freely and voluntarily choose ones religion (though judicial interpretation of religion has sent mixed messages in the past) and the right to "fair" compensation if the government should decide to compulsarily acquire your land, though what exactly constitutes fair is anyones guess

now would it be possible to have a mature discussion for a change?

Oh, really?


What were you saying, again? Maybe I'm just some dumb Yank, but I could swear that you were the first to sling the insults around.

comment refering to a throw away joke about Tehom meeting what many percieve to be the typical American and your refusal to acknowledge it is possible for people to have an opinion on gun control issues and the necessity of the second amendment without actually residing in America, as it appears the intended purpose of that amendment was to possess firearms as a means of protecting the nation via people's militia and NOT to possess firearms for the sake of it this would appear to be a dated right, it is clearly too late to alter this now given the abundance of firearms in the US however which makes the entire discussion a relatively moot point, if anything introducing strict gun control in the US now would actually result in a dramtic increase to violent crime and gun crime

by the way I find it interesting that you (and others) interpreted what was intended to be a joke relating to Tehom's avid interest in guns as a personal attack on Americans

Would you like choice examples or overall statistics? Nevermind, I'll give you both.

http://blacktrianglecampaign.org/2012/1 ... im-ending/

http://statistics.dwp.gov.uk/asd/asd1/a ... s_0712.pdf

Fuck ATOS, fuck Tories, and fuck any of you liberal scum who sneer at the impact of this governments policy on vulnerable people.

[url='http://www.thisishampshire.net/news/9095159.Jobseeker_took_own_life/?ref=rss&utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter']Paul Wilcoxson. June 2011[/url]
A MAN with mental health problems who was worried about benefit cuts killed himself while he was searching for a job on the south coast, an inquest heard.

[url='http://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/news/burnley/9550982.Benefits_man_found_hanged__inquest_heard/?action=complain&cid=10129599']Craig Monk Feb 2012[/url]
A MAN who had “significant worries” was found hanging in his home by a neighbour, a Burnley inquest heard.

[url='http://www.wigantoday.net/news/local-news/tragic-tale-of-man-found-hanging-1-4339316#.T186lcXgBMM.twitter']Mark Higgins March 2012[/url]
Mr Higgins, 22, had been sectioned under the mental health act a week earlier and had been sent to the Brooker Centre in Runcorn as there was not enough room for him at Leigh Infirmary

[url='http://www.nwemail.co.uk/news/barrow-man-hanged-himself-after-finding-friend-s-body-1.936039?referrerPath=home']Joseph Palmer 20 Mar 2012[/url]
Two years before Mr Palmer’s death his benefit was re-assessed, which threw him into a “bit of a panic” as he was not sure where his income would come from, she said.

[url='http://www.eveningnews24.co.uk/news/norwich_man_killed_himself_over_back_to_work_fears_1_1358116#.T5ekzfBBjW0.facebook']Martin Rust April 2012[/url]
Martin Rust, 36, was declared fit to work following a Department of Work and Pensions assessment in September, two months before he was found dead at his home in Parmentergate Court in the city centre on November 21.


[url='http://www.thisislocallondon.co.uk/news/londonnews/9215292.Dad_committed_suicide_after_housing_benefit_cut/']Richard Sanderson 29th May 2011[/url]
A desperate man who lined up three kitchen knives before stabbing himself twice in the heart, blamed cuts in housing benefit.
Unemployed Richard Sanderson took his own life after writing three suicide notes which were laid out neatly on a bed in a meticulously planned act.

[url='http://www.scotsman.com/news/author-s-suicide-due-to-slash-in-benefits-1-1367963']Paul Reekie June 2010[/url]
The Leith-based writer and poet, who was 48, left no suicide note but friends say letters informing him that his welfare benefits were to be halted were found close to his body.

[url='http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/jan/07/mother-suicide-welfare-state']Christelle Pardo, child and unborn child[/url]
Christelle was desperate and applied to take the DWP to tribunal, but repeatedly failed to be given a date for a hearing. She and her baby were by now sharing her sister's one-bedroom flat. Her last attempt to get a date from the tribunal service took place on 12 June. Her sister told the inquest how stressed Christelle was by having nothing to live on. The next day she took her five-month-old son in her arms and jumped to her death from the flat's sixth-floor balcony. Her son died in hospital some hours later.

[url='http://www.thisishullandeastriding.co.uk/Woman-drowned-drain-upset-health-check/story-12927176-detail/story.html']Elaine Christian Feb 2011[/url]
A WOMAN found dead in a drain had been worried about attending a medical appointment to assess disability benefits, an inquest heard.
The body of Elaine Christian, 57, was found in Holderness Drain by a mother returning from a school run.

[url='http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/news/coventry-news/2011/11/08/bedworth-suicide-pact-couple-found-lying-side-by-side-92746-29739580/']David and Helen Mullins Nov 2011[/url]
Mark and Helen Mullins were found lying side by side in their home in Henson Road, Bedworth.
Friends have spoken of the tragic couple’s struggle to access the correct benefits – leaving them living “hand to mouth” on food handouts from a Coventry soup kitchen which they walked five miles to each week.

[url='http://www.dpac.uk.net/2011/05/cuts-kill-the-story-of-a-sister-driven-to-suicide/']Unknown Sister[/url]
We learnt that she had attended the job centre on a number of occasions asking for help and had also asked her doctor for a sick note but was refused. In her desperation she became frantic, the doctor then phoned the police and said she would commit her under the mental health act. She was held for a night in a prison cell because of an argument over a sick note

[url='http://www.blackpoolgazette.co.uk/news/local/back_problems_led_to_fatal_dose_1_437852']Sandra Moon August 2008[/url]
“In the days leading up to her death, Sandra started suffering from stomach pains and had also been extremely upset due to a tribunal regarding her incapacity benefit, as this had been taken off her.

[url='http://www.thisislincolnshire.co.uk/Lincolnshire-man-mental-health-issues-hanged-day/story-16478870-detail/story.html']Christopher Charles Harness. Dec 2011[/url]
An inquest at Louth Sessions House, was told Mr Harness was looked after at The Beeches by carer Lorraine Ruth Jones, but his mental state had deteriorated after hearing his funding was to be withdrawn.



Non suicide deaths Work Capability Assessment related.

[url='http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2011/jul/24/atos-case-study-larry-newman']Larry Newman Oct 2010[/url]
Larry Newman was assessed by an Atos staff member and awarded zero points. To qualify for sickness benefit he needed 15. He died from lung problems soon after

[url='http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/stress-of-tory-benefits-tests-killed-129934']David Groves May 2011 Heart attack.[/url]
A DAD-of-two was killed by the stress of facing the Government’s tough new medical test for benefit claimants, say his grieving family.

[url='http://www.welshfocus.co.uk/2012/06/the-death-of-karen-sherlock/']Karen Sherlock 29th April 2012[/url]
“We need to be passionate about standing up for our rights, and if we can make enough noise, and get enough people to listen then we can overturn the inhumane changes this parasitic government have made. If nothing else, we do still have hope and our rights on our side.”

[url='http://www.formbytimes.co.uk/news/formby-news/2012/05/17/dad-s-fight-for-justice-after-son-died-six-weeks-after-his-benefits-were-cut-100252-30986134/#.T7aGHV2jr3x.twitter']Mark Scott Jan 2012[/url]
A DAD whose son died of pneumonia just six weeks after his incapacity benefits were axed is fighting to have the decision overturned.
Mark Scott, 46, who suffered from anxiety, epilepsy and chronic alcoholism, was left penniless when jobcentre doctors said he was fit to work.

[url='http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?262469-help-me-take-Atos-and-DWP-to-court']Unknown Ladys husband[/url]
My late husband was 3 months from being eligable for pension credit.
He had depression for which he was certificated by his GP and a heart condition.
He started claiming ESA in Feb 09.
During that period he was assessed by Atos who scored him at 0 points
He appealed and this was reviewed and upheld. He did not do the next appeal he died before then.

[url='http://www.birminghammail.net/news/top-stories/2012/07/04/birmingham-dad-dies-of-heart-condition-after-being-ruled-fit-for-work-97319-31317519/']Paul Turner April 2012[/url]
A BIRMINGHAM dad died from a serious heart condition – weeks after Government assessors stopped his benefits and ruled he was fit for work.




Fit to work?

[url='http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/health/father-who-suffered-14-heart-attacks-fit-for-work.17741760']Paul Mickleburgh[/url]
ONE of the world's longest surviving kidney dialysis patients has hit out at the UK Government's "Nazi" tactics after being declared fit to work in a scheme designed to get more people off incapacity benefit.

Paul Mickleburgh, 53, has undergone a series of operations over the past 33 years, including four failed transplants, and has suffered 14 heart attacks.

[url='http://www.thisisstaffordshire.co.uk/Arthritis-sufferer-benefits-cuts-385-month/story-15635369-detail/story.html']Gary Hulme[/url]
AN ARTHRITIS sufferer who struggles to dress himself and cannot walk unaided is being backed by medics after seeing his benefits slashed.
Former warehouse worker Gary Hulme, of Blurton, says he has been left in financial turmoil after seeing his Disability Living Allowance (DLA) package cut from £460 per month to £75.

[url='http://the-newrepublic.blogspot.co.uk/2012/02/atos-suicide-attempt.html']Unknown lady[/url]
I visited a client yesterday on a psychiatric ward.
She had been contacted by ATOS regarding a medical. Her response to this was to slice her own throat open in front of her family.



Driven to despair

[url='http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/jobs/9365087/Unemployed-man-sets-himself-alight-outside-Birmingham-Jobcentre.html']Set himself on fire outside Jobcentre.[/url]
The 48 year old man tied himself to the railings at the building in Harborne Lane, Selly Oak, before ripping his one of his trouser legs and starting a fire


[url='http://www.wirralnews.co.uk/wirral-news/local-wirral-news/2012/05/18/man-in-hospital-after-slashing-wrists-in-birkenhead-jobcentre-100252-30994547/']Slashed wrists inside Jobcentre.[/url]
A MAN was in hospital after slashing his wrists at a job centre in Merseyside.
Emergency services were called to the scene at the Jobcentre Plus, in Price Street, Birkenhead, yesterday afternoon.
[/quote]

Ahh wonky formatting. Fuck it, all the material's there.

overlong post with largely speculative data, of course those close to an individual would say things like "stress killed him" or "she was desperate" etc, you can't prove your claim with emotion driven articles which are lacking in any credible factual information.

you have at best one provable case in the articles you have made reference to and even in the case of the suicide notes the rationalisations of someone who is distraught enough to take their own life are rarely reliable

side note (and this is just my opinion) suicides are selfish cowards, I can think of nothing more selfish or pathetic then taking your own life, it shows total disregard for one's family and friends who will be left behind grieving the loss of their friend, mother, sister, aunt or whatever the case may be, and cowardly because it is the ultimate "i give up" statement, oh life is hard so I'm gonna kill myself? why should those types of people be pitied?

(if I have offended or upset anyone with the above statement I wholeheartedly apologise)

This slippery slope argument just doesn't work. This assumes that the second amendment is keeping down crime as if once the guns go away criminals would just come out of the woodworks. Not to mention the fact that legal gun pool is where illegal guns often come from. And I still don't believe in this notion of defense. Shotgun or not, pulling a gun out on someone who has a gun might work on TV, but not in real life.

"Stress killed him" and "she was desperate" is exactly what I'm arguing. Government has loads of people on disability and illness benefits. Government suddenly decides "fuck disabled people" and declares many of them "fit to work", stripping their benefits. People with no income anymore are driven to desperate measures because the government has taken away their will to live. No credible evidence? People died. The government not only failed to help them, but pretty much gave them loaded guns.

Relentless Oblivion:

I'm trying to figure out how we got from point A to point B. Yes, some people insult other people on the forum here, especially when the politics forum is active. But would you expect less from a forum with your buddy Tehom on it? It has always been this way, and actually this is a much less hostile place than it was in 2005-06.

Stick to the reviews and music discussion only for a while, much less ad hominem normally in those places.

I would agree with Frig in terms of the fact that when it comes to something like suicide emotional clusterfucks are what you are dealing with. When you are contemplating suicide and presumably when you commit suicide, you are an emotional clusterfuck. However, to try to find some rationalization behind the actions is barking up the wrong tree. What you have are people in dire situations, as many people are these days, and so what drove them to off themselves? You either armchair psychologize and say that they are "emotionally ill" or label them as a way of dismissing them as "selfish cowards". This is the epitome of the ideological logic that permeates society; you're a rationally self-interested individual until you resist or don't do what is expected of you. Then you become irrational. What would make someone think that their "life is hard" to such a degree that they would want to kill themselves? You would want to look how there lives are always already difficult due to their disability compounded with the fact that any support they once had has immediately been cut and hence their live becomes unlivable.

In many ways, it mirrors the Irish potato famine all over again. A systematic policy change created to enact a fabricated account of scarcity in order to either off a large number of the population that society is supposed to support (the collectivization of society is predicated on the notion that there are those who cannot care for them and we, as a society, take care of them, e.g., the elderly, the young and the disabled) or to bring new individuals into the labor force in order to drive down the costs of labor, due to the abundance of excess labor that is now facing destitution in the loss of their livelihood.

I don't think we're as hostile as we might appear insofar as everyone is familiar with one another. Steve can be a dick, but Frig and I's antagonism towards V is pretty out in the open and non-consequential. DW pokes fun, but never means harm by it. I get rowdy when it comes to politics. And yeah, USBM is always going to get the stink eye and I am cool with that. People aren't insulting one another as much as it might appear is what I'm saying.

I agree. Some of us might do better by not crossing the line as much on people that obviously are annoyed by it, but there are a lot of people that have been here for a long time (Thy Serpent, Metastable, December Flower, Raven, to name a few) that manage to stay under the radar, contribute to the reviews/metal discussion of the board, and stay free from all the "personalities drama" of the forum.

Political discussions get heated; if you don't like the heat stay out of the kitchen, as the saying goes.

Anyway, Trapt, Steve and myself were having a relativeley civilzed discussion regarding the 2nd Samendment, before the non-American interjected. He says it was in jest, but I don't buy it; been in too many of these debates to not be able to tell the difference, especially when it fits the typical non-American position on the topic of firearms; if I am indeed wrong in assessment of the situation, then what can I say? Shit happens.

At the end of the day, though Trapt and myself are pretty much on opposite ends of the political spectrum, we are still on the same side; that is, we love this country and want what is best for it.

My skin crawled with that last line. You know that, right? But you are correct.

WTF happenened to my avatar status?