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PostPosted: Sat Sep 07, 2013 1:52 am 
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traptunderice wrote:
cry of the banshee wrote:
also, he has made it clear that he (in his very wrong opinion) "doesn't need congressional approval".
He's right though. He doesn't need their approval to strike.

This article, written by one of my profs: http://thebulletin.org/syria-and-limits-realpolitik


Not true


Constitution and War Powers Resolution are clear.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Article_On ... f_Congress

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_Powers_Resolution

How do you figure he has the authority to launch a pre-emptive war when we are not being directly threatened?


At any rate, that wasn't the tune he and his whacky sidekick Joe were singing when W was in the WH.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 08, 2013 8:17 pm 
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http://www.registercitizen.com/general- ... f-citizens

Quote:
The Obama administration secretly won permission from a surveillance court in 2011 to reverse restrictions on the National Security Agency’s use of intercepted phone calls and e-mails, permitting the agency to search deliberately for Americans’ communications in its massive databases, according to interviews with government officials and recently declassified material.


This, along with everything else that this absolutely corrupt administration have been involved in (and tis is just the stuff that has been brought to light), should be setting off alarm bells and raising all kinds of red flags.

Quote:
What had not been previously acknowledged is that the court in 2008 imposed an explicit ban — at the government’s request — on those kinds of searches, that officials in 2011 got the court to lift the bar and that the search authority has been used.


Dubya was Prez in '08... how sad and alarming that this Admin is actually making ol' W look benign.

We are rapidy becoming the United Stasi of America.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2013 11:53 pm 
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cry of the banshee wrote:
How do you figure he has the authority to launch a pre-emptive war when we are not being directly threatened?
Ah. Didn't remember the whole "directly threatened" bit.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2013 2:42 am 
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traptunderice wrote:
cry of the banshee wrote:
How do you figure he has the authority to launch a pre-emptive war when we are not being directly threatened?
Ah. Didn't remember the whole "directly threatened" bit.


It happens.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 9:24 pm 
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cry of the banshee wrote:
traptunderice wrote:
cry of the banshee wrote:
How do you figure he has the authority to launch a pre-emptive war when we are not being directly threatened?
Ah. Didn't remember the whole "directly threatened" bit.


It happens.
But yeah, this whole Syria drive was a fucking joke. And Fox's response to Putin's intervention was fucking pathetic.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 9:29 pm 
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traptunderice wrote:
cry of the banshee wrote:
traptunderice wrote:
cry of the banshee wrote:
How do you figure he has the authority to launch a pre-emptive war when we are not being directly threatened?
Ah. Didn't remember the whole "directly threatened" bit.


It happens.
But yeah, this whole Syria drive was a fucking joke. And Fox's response to Putin's intervention was fucking pathetic.


What was it? I've just been getting amused over our scummy politicians like Menendez and Boehner get angry about Putin's New York Times editorial.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 9:55 pm 
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North From Here wrote:
traptunderice wrote:
cry of the banshee wrote:
traptunderice wrote:
cry of the banshee wrote:
How do you figure he has the authority to launch a pre-emptive war when we are not being directly threatened?
Ah. Didn't remember the whole "directly threatened" bit.


It happens.
But yeah, this whole Syria drive was a fucking joke. And Fox's response to Putin's intervention was fucking pathetic.


What was it? I've just been getting amused over our scummy politicians like Menendez and Boehner get angry about Putin's New York Times editorial.
Forgive the source, but the most concise montage of the idiocy: http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/tue-s ... blue-bombs

Starts around 2:39. You can't frame that shit any worse than it actually is.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 11:55 pm 
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Don't blame FOX for this admistrations humilliating incompetence.

This president and his administration are a disgrace.

Actually, WE didn't avoid anything; Russia is now controlling this game, and the FOX pundits are right: we were made to look like clowns. Russia came out as the real winner here. We look stupid, weak and incompetent; these asshats (Zero and his admin) can''t even keep their stories straight. Our credibilty is shot.

Jon Stewart is spinning his ass off, making it sound as if WE avoided a conflict, (while Zero's big mouth and lack of testicular fortitude is what got ius into this mess to begin with). Big surprise, another water carrying drone for Obammy.

http://thelead.blogs.cnn.com/2013/09/11 ... nyt-op-ed/

Quote:
“He put this proposal forward and he’s now invested in it. That’s good. That’s the best possible reaction. He’s fully invested in Syria’s CW disarmament and that’s potentially better than a military strike – which would deter and degrade but wouldn’t get rid of all the chemical weapons. He now owns this. He has fully asserted ownership of it and he needs to deliver.”



Putin completely schooled Obama and Kerry. He got exactly what he wanted.


http://news.yahoo.com/assad-syria-fulfi ... 33528.html

Quote:
"When we see the United States really wants stability in our region and stops threatening, striving to attack, and also ceases arms deliveries to terrorists, then we will believe that the necessary processes can be finalized," he was quoted as saying in an interview with Russian state television.


:lol:

Dumbasses.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2013 2:02 am 
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Somewhere Putin is chugging down a bottle of Vodka in celebration on making the US government look like pathetic fools that they are.

But in reality it really doesn't take much to make those idiots in DC looks like fools since they do such a wonderful job in doing it themselves :lol:


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2013 2:31 am 
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I also get a real kick in the ass at how FOX is still trotted out as the go-to object of the Two- Minutes Hate (nope, that never gets stale, amirite?); nobody ever mentions those imbeciles over at MSNBC... why is that?

Not saying FOX isnt biased as hell, but lets be fair here. (I do enjoy Greg Gutfeld's commentary at times, though).

Watching MSNBC is the "informational" equivalent of chronic glue sniffing.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2013 7:07 am 
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I'd rather Obozo make an ass of himself and the same idiotic Neoconservative foreign policy ideals than waste billions in missile strikes, maintaining a no-fly zone, and killing more civilians in order to "protect them".


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2013 8:01 am 
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Nickelback666 wrote:
I'd rather Obozo make an ass of himself and the same idiotic Neoconservative foreign policy ideals than waste billions in missile strikes, maintaining a no-fly zone, and killing more civilians in order to "protect them".


Granted, but it's gonna happen sooner (more likey) than later. mark my words we are on a collision course with Iran, Its not a matter of if, but of when.
Obongo will make an ass of himself, regardless. Thats what you get when you apply affirmitive action to something as important as Prez of the USA.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2013 8:09 am 
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Ahmadinejad was more caustic than the incumbent leader of Iran, and it would be a fool's errand to attack Syria when they are in a mutual agreement of defense. I don't see what legitimate reason to attack Iran at all, if it comes through some proxy foreign policy matter i,e tension with Israel than who cares tbh? It just amazes me that every time so much as anyone farts in the Middle east, the neocons are quick to declare war


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2013 8:18 am 
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Nickelback666 wrote:
Ahmadinejad was more caustic than the incumbent leader of Iran, and it would be a fool's errand to attack Syria when they are in a mutual agreement of defense. I don't see what legitimate reason to attack Iran at all, if it comes through some proxy foreign policy matter i,e tension with Israel than who cares tbh? It just amazes me that every time so much as anyone farts in the Middle east, the neocons are quick to declare war


The neocons never left washington; PNAC laid it all out. Obeezy is just another corporate statist neocon puppet, and the next one will be likewise and the next... unless something drastic happens. Take a look at a map of our bases in the ME: Iran is surrounded. Coincidence?

As for Syria, they are a proxy of Iran. Iran is backed by Russia, and probably China. We are over-extending our "sphere of influence" in the region, and if we aren't careful it will be a disaster.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2013 8:26 am 
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At this point in my life I'm kind of wondering if Obama shouldn't just attack Iran and have the thing blow up in his face. Obviously, if what you're saying is true- Putin at least had the sense to avert a "collision" course temporarily unlike the stooge we have in office. Though I should probably admit that Obummer was more than likely dictated too to attack, there is no changing of the system we have. I've realized that there are too many interests in all aspects of the American government, I'm at the point where I want the federal government to collapse whether by its own undoing or some other event.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2013 8:32 am 
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Saudi Arabia.


And Petrodollars.
The answer to the riddle, which in truth makes it a not so simple situation.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2013 8:39 am 
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Nickelback666 wrote:
At this point in my life I'm kind of wondering if Obama shouldn't just attack Iran and have the thing blow up in his face. Obviously, if what you're saying is true- Putin at least had the sense to avert a "collision" course temporarily unlike the stooge we have in office. Though I should probably admit that Obummer was more than likely dictated too to attack, there is no changing of the system we have. I've realized that there are too many interests in all aspects of the American government, I'm at the point where I want the federal government to collapse whether by its own undoing or some other event.


If we attack Syria, or Iran, I suspect it may be WWIII. Russia will not allow it.
Just as we would not allow Russia to attack Israel.

And we blinked; that is absolutely not lost on Putin.

It's both a starkly simple and very complex situation. Whatever you or I feel about the path our government is on, the ME is of vital importance to our economy, hence our survival as a nation.
I don't see the power hungry sociopaths in washington (more to the point, the lobbies that control them) just letting it slide.

Where it gets complicated is: it is also vital to Russia, and even more so, China.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2013 8:46 am 
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Its chickens coming home to roost as far as I'm concerned. The US fucked over those countries years ago by unilateral support for Israel, supporting different tribal power struggles, and killing off respective populations and by pursuing the gun over diplomacy. It either should've dealt with them through diplomacy, or done drilling elsewhere seeing as there are new reserves being discovered all the time. It makes no sense that we're trying yet again another military strike, it didn't work in Iraq, Libya, Afghanistan, and now potentially Syria. This is the logical endgame of a foreign policy that is at odds with itself. We could be drilling in the Arctic/Antarctic, scouting for different reserves, ending regulations to let companies search for alternative energy sources, but no the US wants to play the same failed geopolitical war games.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2013 8:53 am 
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Nickelback666 wrote:
Its chickens coming home to roost as far as I'm concerned. The US fucked over those countries years ago by unilateral support for Israel, supporting different tribal power struggles, and killing off respective populations and by pursuing the gun over diplomacy. It either should've dealt with them through diplomacy, or done drilling elsewhere seeing as there are new reserves being discovered all the time. It makes no sense that we're trying yet again another military strike, it didn't work in Iraq, Libya, Afghanistan, and now potentially Syria. This is the logical endgame of a foreign policy that is at odds with itself. We could be drilling in the Arctic/Antarctic, scouting for different reserves, ending regulations to let companies search for alternative energy sources, but no the US wants to play the same failed geopolitical war games.


Yeah. I love what this country was founded upon; property rights, freedom of speech, freedom of association, 2nd amendment, and the rest.
But...

Imperialism or whatever you want to call it ALWAYS comes back to bite you in ass. What they say about history repeating itself etc etc, blahblahblah... humans never learn.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2013 7:33 pm 
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Another factor is obviously Israel. Our proxy (some would say they have more power over our ME foriegn policy than that of a mere proxy, but that's another topic).Then there is the PNAC manifesto, further complicating matters.

Hezbollah in Syria (through Iran, if I'm not mistaken; the players on the board there get confusing at times) is on the side of Assad.
Hezbollah and Israel are of course deadly foes.

So on one side, we have that. On the other we have the petrodollar (our bit via Saudi Arabia).
Then you have a bungling administration that draws "red lines" he is unwilling to back up, fucking up on the job as usual.

Quote:
The petrodollar system originated in the early 1970s in the wake of the Bretton Woods collapse. President Richard Nixon and his Secretary of State, Henry Kissinger, feared that the abandonment of the international gold standard under the Bretton Woods arrangement (combined with a growing US trade deficit, and massive debt associated with the ongoing Vietnam War) would cause a decline in the relative global demand of the U.S. dollar.[2] In a series of meetings, the United States — represented by then U.S. Secretary of State Henry Kissinger — and the Saudi royal family made an agreement. The United States would offer military protection for Saudi Arabia’s oil fields, and in return the Saudi's would price their oil sales exclusively in United States dollars (in other words, the Saudis were to refuse all other currencies, except the U.S. dollar, as payment for their oil exports).

By 1975, all of the oil-producing nations of OPEC had agreed to price their oil in dollars and to invest surplus oil proceeds in U.S. government debt securities in exchange for similar offers by the U.S



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Petrodollar_warfare

Note that evey single country we have attacked has threatened or made moves to trade in something other than the dollar; Iran is, of course, taking steps towards establishing their own bourse.
Connect the dots.

We are willing to at the very least arm the "rebels", who are mainly Islamist radicals and terrorists that excecute women and children (I wouldn't be the least bit surprised to learn the were the ones that used the CWs honestly) and are linked with al-qaeda. On it's face, it seems bizzare, but when you add it all up, the deals we have with both Israel and the Saudi's (maintaining the standard of the petrodollar), you can begin to see our governments motives.
I understand, academically at least, the part about maintaining the petrodollar, but I don't understand what Israel offers us in return for our eternal backup. And they are a huge factor in our ME policy.


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