Mixed Martial Arts... Any Fans?

RelentlessOblivion

we're not saying the guys in UFC aren't great fighters mate, just that because of the nature of the sport they tend to have (from what I have observed) general knowledge of multiple disciplines but mastery of one, two at best so unless you're pitting a striker against the Muay Thai fighter, who has complete mastery over his discipline, it would be an unbalanced fight, don't forget the majority of Muay Thai fights end via knockout, these fighters are cardio machines to fight at incredibly high intensity for five two minute rounds per fight and often fight two or three times on a card, from what I've seen on youtube of Silva's fights he would be more then a match for most Muay Thai fighters but then that is where he started so isn't overly surprising

traptunderice

RelentlessOblivion wrote
we're not saying the guys in UFC aren't great fighters mate, just that because of the nature of the sport they tend to have (from what I have observed) general knowledge of multiple disciplines but mastery of one, two at best so unless you're pitting a striker against the Muay Thai fighter, who has complete mastery over his discipline, it would be an unbalanced fight, don't forget the majority of Muay Thai fights end via knockout, these fighters are cardio machines to fight at incredibly high intensity for five two minute rounds per fight and often fight two or three times on a card, from what I've seen on youtube of Silva's fights he would be more then a match for most Muay Thai fighters but then that is where he started so isn't overly surprising

His argument that no matter how intense they are, they aren't trained to defend against the most basic grappling or holds beyond clinching and so once they overextend or get taken down they're fucked.

RelentlessOblivion

which relies on the assumption that the Muay Thai fighter will make a mistake before he knocks out the MMA fighter, but even if the Muay Thai fighter is taken down he will still be in a position to fight off the MMA fighter who will still need to get in close and brapple on the ground bringing himself into striking range for elbows or kicks, they will pack less force but would still be sufficient to buy the Muay Thai fighter time to regain his feet

Tompa

You think a muay thai fighter will knock someone out before they manage to grab a hold on them? They get maybe one swing if the mma fighter shoots for the takedown right away. Once they're on the ground the fight is over.

Randy Couture did that very thing against a boxer a couple of years back. Now I'll give you that a muay thai fighter will have a much better chance than a boxer will, but I don't see the outcome being much different. Muay thai guys are awesome stand up fighters but the ground game will be as alien to them as to boxers.

<a class="postlink" href="http://youtu.be/rm9tbWgXm88?t=10m43s">http://youtu.be/rm9tbWgXm88?t=10m43s</a>

DevotedWalnut

RelentlessOblivion wrote
which relies on the assumption that the Muay Thai fighter will make a mistake before he knocks out the MMA fighter, but even if the Muay Thai fighter is taken down he will still be in a position to fight off the MMA fighter who will still need to get in close and brapple on the ground bringing himself into striking range for elbows or kicks, they will pack less force but would still be sufficient to buy the Muay Thai fighter time to regain his feet

Dude watch old UFC when it was just pure wrestlers vs pure jiu-jitsu vs muay thai vs American boxing vs shooto vs savate vs clinch fighting, etc...

Clinch fighting won every time. You get an all American wrestler or a
Judo fighter who's been grappling since they were young would destroy a muay Thai fighter. Put them on their ass and make their head mince meat with the mat. It's pretty ignorant and shows a lack of knowledge in clinch fighting to think otherwise.

DevotedWalnut

Tompa wrote
You think a muay thai fighter will knock someone out before they manage to grab a hold on them? They get maybe one swing if the mma fighter shoots for the takedown right away. Once they're on the ground the fight is over.Randy Couture did that very thing against a boxer a couple of years back. Now I'll give you that a muay thai fighter will have a much better chance than a boxer will, but I don't see the outcome being much different. Muay thai guys are awesome stand up fighters but the ground game will be as alien to them as to boxers.<a class="postlink" href="http://youtu.be/rm9tbWgXm88?t=10m43s">http://youtu.be/rm9tbWgXm88?t=10m43s</a>

fucking 1

If you dont train wrestling or judo you'll be put on your ass over and over again.

traptunderice

I guess something like this could happen: <a class="postlink" href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvcxqkPO6x4">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvcxqkPO6x4</a> (skip to 1:00). But the chances of that happening again and again are unlikely. If the knee or punch misses just the slightest bit, they're going to shake it off and be submitting you pronto.

DevotedWalnut

traptunderice wrote
I guess something like this could happen: <a class="postlink" href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvcxqkPO6x4">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvcxqkPO6x4</a> (skip to 1:00). But the chances of that happening again and again are unlikely. If the knee or punch misses just the slightest bit, they're going to shake it off and be submitting you pronto.

Obviously running into a guy head first can result in getting knocked the fuck out, I understand and respect that. But MMA wrestlers expect to take punishment while attempting takedowns. Sure they get caught, everybody does, but they know how to avoid most damage or learn to fight through it. Just ask Chael Sonnen. In the 4th round of his first fight with Silva, he ate a kick to the gut and instantly shot in for a double. He went on to say that was the hardest kick he'd ever felt and couldn't breathe for a while. Yet he still scored the double and continued his beat down on Silva.

Then as you know, Anderson Silva with his muay Thai completely ineffective basically the entire fight, used his JIU-JITSU to win.

Respect ground fighting. It's what is truly dominant.

RelentlessOblivion

in an MMA fight yes ground skills are important, I still think the Muay Thai fighter would stand a good chance of winning the fight against an MMA fighter because I don't care how tough you are copping a knee to the face whilst trying to bring the Muay Thai fighter to the ground will put you on your ass, and I'd say even the UFC's best strikers would be totally outclassed in a Muay Thai fight

you are right though having not watched MMA in so long my knowledge of the sport is quite limited, I know a great deal more about Muay Thai and so perhaps I'm coming off as a bit arrogant not giving the MMA fighters as much respect as I should

Thrashtildeth

And around and around we go!

RelentlessOblivion

Chuck Norris would own everyone...

DevotedWalnut

My picks:

Condit, Hendricks, Carmont, Phillippou, Hominick.

With dos Anjos getting the win on the undercards.

Also, Shane Carwin and Gray Maynard have both injured themselves and have pulled out of their respective fights against Roy Nelson and Joe Lauzon. Jim Miller has stepped up to fight Lauzon at UFC 155, but the search for a replacement for Carwin continues.

Just when you think it was over, it starts up again. Eddie Yagin just pulled out of his fight last week against Dennis Siver, replaced by Nam Phan, and now these two today. Fucking injuries. Go away.

traptunderice

DevotedWalnut wrote
My picks:Condit, Hendricks, Carmont, Phillippou, Hominick.

It'll be interesting to watch. I kinda like that we only share two of the same picks. Debating whether I want to watch the event. The buddy I usually go with will be out of town.

You don't think GSP has it in him?

And are there hypotheses as to why so many injuries? what the fuck. And Carwin just dropped out because he witnessed first hand Nelson's training style lol.

RelentlessOblivion

are they soft tissue injuries or muscle tears? drawing on my knowledge of AFL often times these kinds of injuries will occur because a) the athlete is naturally inclined towards injury so it's a recurring problem (in the case of AFL player Hamish Hartlett it's a recurring hamstring issue) b) over-training or the wrong approach to training, again drawing on AFL the Essendon football club had this problem, their new fitness coach had a regime which was more then the players could handle consequently their bodies just couldn't take any more and various muscle strains and tears occured, or c) freak occurences such as simply twisting the wrong way and tearing a muscle or things like that

maybe these people who are suffering frequent injuries need to dial back their training once they recover just enough to maintain their fitness level without creating substantial injury risks

DevotedWalnut

traptunderice wrote
DevotedWalnut wrote
My picks:Condit, Hendricks, Carmont, Phillippou, Hominick.
It'll be interesting to watch. I kinda like that we only share two of the same picks. Debating whether I want to watch the event. The buddy I usually go with will be out of town.You don't think GSP has it in him?And are there hypotheses as to why so many injuries? what the fuck. And Carwin just dropped out because he witnessed first hand Nelson's training style lol.

I don't like the fact that GSP hasn't fought in 19 months and that Condit will be, IMO, by far the best fighter he has ever fought. Condit can take this fight anywhere and be dangerous. I'd love to see old GSP back, and he just come out and dominate en route to a TKO or dominant decision win, but I just don't see it happening. Not only has he been out 19 months, he's coming back from a major ACL tear, that shit is serious. I've got $100 on Condit, and $10 on all my other picks, as well as another $10 on Sam Stout.

As for the injuries, the only thing that makes sense is that as the sport continues to grow and the fighters get better then everybody has to train harder than everybody else. And when you're training against other elite level UFC/MMA fighters, you're bound to get banged up. Plus the smackdown they are trying to lay on performance enhancing drugs may be making some fighters who are use to taking it more vulnerable to injuries.

RelentlessOblivion

watching UFC 73 Frankie Edgar v Mark Bocek, Edgar wins by TKO 4:55 into the first round really one sided fight but not really a good one

DevotedWalnut

Most Boceks fights are boring. He's a lay and prey-er. Edgar is good though, eventually won the title and defended it 3 times.

RelentlessOblivion

second fight was a jiu jitsu masterclass won via Triangle Choke, third fight went to the judges, first round of that one was great but two and three were pretty poor, fourth fight was won by Rear Naked Choke and the fifth fight has had it's moments, Heath Herring could have won it in the first round but blew his chance

DevotedWalnut

HA! Heath Herring. Now there's a name I have not heard in a while. Who did he fight?

RelentlessOblivion

Minotauro Nogueira, Heriing lost by judges decision

lightweight title fight between Sean Sherk and Hermes Franca was diminated by Sherk on the mat but went the full five rounds to the judges so wasn't much to watch

follow-up fight was Kenny Florian v Alvin Robinson, Florian won it in the first round by TKO

current fight is Tito Ortiz v Rashad Evans, should be a good one

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