Metal Reviews

By the way, discussions on politics can turn ugly. I'm about done with it myself! =) Let's keep it civil(Zad).

Um, tell me how the invaders are better than the terrorists, someone?

And guess what? Sometimes I wish an entire race of people did get massacred, if that makes that all right.

Yep.



Not as much as they are now. Good job.



That's true. Maybe it wasn't such a good idea to kick that proverbial beehive, eh?



Similar people? You mean Arabs? Hey, I don't like the look of North Korea, so we should stamp on Thailand before they get us- they're pretty similar.



You really believe that this has made another 9/11 less likely? Propaganda 1, Common sense 0.



Not true. Many Americans have a persecution complex. A lot of the people that opposed Iraq were right behind you in the Balkans, for example. And do you believe that there would be this level of outcry if the US hadn't invaded Iraq?



So, if you ever wonder again where Anti-US feeling comes from- here it is in a nutshell. Arrogance and myopia. Actually, the Red Army did as much to save Europe's "war torn ass" as the US in WW2. So how about that? Europe was saved from the second worst murderer of the 20th century, by the first worst!



Agreed 75%



Yep. Isolationist policies=sucky policies, as a general rule.



Well, I could be cynical and say that while you aren't, I'm sure there are a few American CEOs that are. But that's not really something I want to get into right now.



Great... I'm so thoroughly impressed by your military might. Don't worry, dead Iraqis, we could go much harder on you, but we just chose not to!

Before the War, I was 60/40 in favour of it. My natural instinct was to be against it, but then I thought that Saddam was such an awful ruler, that it would be better for Iraqi citizens in the long run. Now I am pretty happy to admit I was wrong about that. It was total folly, and I don't believe Iraq will be a safe country to live in for a long, long time.

Hehe, anyway, long post. But please understand I am in a quiet spell at work, and like to rant

i suggest ppl watch the documentry called "
Uncovered - The Whole Truth About the Iraq War
".. then you'll see how much bullshit is going on behind the ppls backs. Weapons of mass destruction was just an idea they come up with in order to invade Iraq. And this is not some losers who don't know what they are talking about, it's military ppl of high rank and politicians etc.
Let's not forget that the government also had plans even before 11. sept to invade Iraq once again.

If Iraq indeed had weapons of massdestruction it would have been the rest of those chemical weapons and deadly viruses that Reagan sold to Iraq during the 80's during their war against Iran. ( and behind the Iraqi ppl's back they also sold weapons to Iran, quite fun)

And when i write the soldiers are saving Bush' face, i mean that establishing a democracy etc etc was not a part of Bush' original plan. He got pretty unpopular pretty quick due to the war, and way of getting gain face again he decided to establish a democracy in the country. This was not intended from the beginning, just a mere solution he came up with in the last few minutes.


another thing... i like the fact that weapons inspectors found Iraqi balistic missils with too long range, illigal... but... at the same time the American troops use napalm bombs with even more deadly than the original one.. lovely

What do you mean by "the invaders"? If you mean the ordinary US troops, then it's because they were made to go, and they are not (99.99999% of the time) targetting innocent civilians- which the terrorists are doing regularly. That's a big difference.

If you mean the people whose idea the invasion was, then I like to follow this golden rule:

Corrupt Western government led by imbecile > maniacal radical Islamist state. At least Bush lets women go to football games

Which race do you wish had got massacred, out of interest? :shock:

Do you think terrorists are not indoctrinated?

Indeed they are. The terrorists are indoctrinated specifically to kill civillians, whereas the US army is indoctrinated to try and avoid killing civillians as much as possible. Frequently they do a poor job of that, but to me they still have the moral high ground. Wouldn't you agree?

It's easy to understand why the terrorists hate the invaders, but excusing their actions is impossible.

They do have the moral high ground in our western gaze, yet their moral ground is not theirs. That's why I don't thing their are to be considered better people than the terrorists.

Saddam let the woman go to football games too. He was a dictator, but not islamist, was a laic dictature.

You're confusing them with Iran or Saudi Arabia (hey, that's not the country of USA's allies where manly all 11/9 terrorist where from?)

But this war was an error. It unsettled the viper's nest, and it gives a lesson to the rest of countries: if you are in the USA enemies list, get weapons of mass destruction asap. North Korea has done, Iran is doing it now. If you don't have, you'll be attaked.

And I'm not defendig Saddam. He is a criminal. As half the world dirigents, including the king of Saudi Arabia.

That's true about Saddam, but what I meant was that a "maniacal radical Islamist state" is what the people perpetrating the recent suicide bombings would like to see. The suicide terrorism is not being done on Saddam's behalf. It's done by people that have more in common with the other countries you mentioned.

But you seem to be saying that because an Iraqi suicide bomber has a different moral compass and value system to us in the West, we are in no position to judge their actions. Respect towards civillian life is something that should be upheld whatever your culture. And I'm afraid the bottom line for me is simply that your average US soldier shows more respect for it than your average suicide bomber.

Yes, he does, but in my view, and yours, but why are civilians innocent and people doing their duty, whatever that is, not?

I don't think "innocence" is the right word- I am not saying that each and every soldier is "guilty". But if you are in the army you are a fighter, and if you are a fighter you have to expect risk. It's not a question of Western perception. Does Islam, or Arabic culture, say that civillians are as legitimate a target as the military? No it doesn't, so we can't argue that suicide bombers simply have an equal but different type of morality. What they are doing is just as wrong in their own culture as in ours.

Sorry, it's not morally wrong in their subculture, the Jihad is a holy war to them.

And Jihad means the murder of civillians whose only crime is to live in Baghdad? If you're going to use such an antiquated interpretation of it, then you could also use the bible to justify all manner of things that we would regard as unnaceptable in the West. Stoning, for example.

It is their interpretation, it is what they are fully convinced of is right, are they to blame they believe in something that clashes with what the rest of the world thinks?

Are you saying that simply believing something to be right makes it so? How about the loony Christian woman at the start of this thread? She believes what she is doing is right, so does that mean she is beyond criticism?

I am sure you would not condone a Christian murdering a homosexual, even if he believed it to be God's will. Why should we make allowances for extremist Muslims?

At school right now so I can't post an extended arguement. However, I want it be known that I DO NOT SUPPORT THE IRAQ WAR god damn it. I'm only defending our soldiers. I agree that we shouldn't have gone there and that Bush definately didn't wait long enough.

Someone posted some "Uncovered Truth!" documentary. Just to let you know that for every "documentary" exposing some crazy conspiracy, there is another proving Bush's side as well. Find a real source of information.

Finally, I agree with rio against Misha. I'm going to rape your family tomorrow Misha, because, in my opinion, it is morally alright. Society and humans in general DO have a moral standard. It can vary but it is undeniable that we tend to learn one way or another. There is no excuse for infringing on the beliefs or lives of others who do not follow your specific moral code.

You misunderstand, we can criticise them, we can prevent them from their actions, but we can't kill them for it. The woman can, of course, be criticized, she can be laughed at, condemned, hated yet not spilled or attacked. Basicly, we can prevent people from attacking our countries, lock them up if their do anything against the laws in our countries. If a buglar comes to my house, I'm going to call the police, or smash him in the face, or whatever. But I'm not going to his neighbourhood to steal something from his relatives, right?

UUUUUUuuuuuuuuuggggggggggggghhhhhhhhh!

How gross, you turned a thread about a fucking joke into this garbage. I'm sick of hearing this shit. I can't go anywhere without this pointless argument raging.

NEWSFLASH-The US is in Iraq and that's not going to change anytime soon. End of debate.

Also, as much as I wish things were different, the world doesn't work in terms of "Peace, Love, and Rainbows for everybody"