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PostPosted: Sun Oct 17, 2004 11:05 am 
I think that's how most people are, but personally, I like any music that's very well done. Obviously, I still have my preferences: for example, I really love Melodic Death Metal.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Oct 17, 2004 11:30 am 
Jaden wrote:
A few things...

First, don't diss Killswitch Engage, deathkvlt (you did not list them as one of the bands that did not suck. I assure you Killswitch Engage kicks major ass).

Second, Atreyu does indeed suck.

Third, not all hardcore is bad. Examples: Between the Buried and Me, Dillinger Escape Plan, and I honestly like Avenged Sevenfold (I hate Thrice and others though). Most hardcore IS bad mind you (but then again, most metal is too). My biggest criticism about hardcore is the fact that it doesn't branch out enough--90% of hardcore sounds the same. Lately, though, I'm hearing a lot of hardcore bands getting pretty damn technical and doing cooler shit than most metal bands.

And lastly, Black metal is stupid for the most part. Sorry, but it is. The lyrics are retarded. The musicianship is usually shitty (it's just fast... so fucking what? Yeah... blast beats... try something new). And the vocals are terrible. Sorry, but as a vocalist myself, I must say they're just retarded. Obviously there are exceptions, but this is my general consensus on most black metal that I do hear. And I'll honestly say, I prefer hardcore.

I'm a progressive metalhead myself. I like my music technical and different (go Sikth!). I like extremes. And some of the newer hardcore that I've heard from the underground has impressed me (most still sucks, but nonetheless).

I've always considered this a site that "knows their shit", but my biggest critisism (more to the users than the reviewers) is that some people are too stuck up with being "metal", rather than simply being fans of good musicianship. Of good song writing. Of good music period. I call myself a metalhead because I find that most good music is metal. Classical is great too. :wink:

-Jaden

EDIT: Oh, and about The Haunted album. I like The Haunted, and I'll make my own judgement after I hear it.


Good point !

if you wish i can tell you 'bout some indie hardcore band (the sub-genre has been called Math Rock) you might never had heard of and which play some really cool progressive stuff, sometimes quite quiet stuff but still with a powerfull songwriting, good melodies (yes !), and interesting song structures...

first try FARAQUEST "The View From This Tower" (Dischord 2000), though the group disbanded after this sole recording it's a real GREAT ALBUM !!!


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 Post subject: oups !
PostPosted: Sun Oct 17, 2004 11:36 am 
sorry, the name of the band is FARAQUET, no quest in their art except for perfection (so close !)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Oct 17, 2004 7:39 pm 
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Svartalfar
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Jaden wrote:
... simply being fans of good music period...


Amen!
And yes, classical music do rule. I, personally, would choose Jean Sibelius over any black metal band any day! He really kicks all black metals ass. Its THAT atmospheric and cold!
It's quite simplistic classical music, but the atmosphere is unmatched.

And btw The Immortal Emokid:
You're welcome. There is a very fine line between having different oppinions and debating them with reasonable arguments, and just being stubborn, rude and stupid...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Oct 17, 2004 9:25 pm 
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Jaden wrote:
A few things...

First, don't diss Killswitch Engage, deathkvlt (you did not list them as one of the bands that did not suck. I assure you Killswitch Engage kicks major ass).

Second, Atreyu does indeed suck.

Third, not all hardcore is bad. Examples: Between the Buried and Me, Dillinger Escape Plan, and I honestly like Avenged Sevenfold (I hate Thrice and others though). Most hardcore IS bad mind you (but then again, most metal is too). My biggest criticism about hardcore is the fact that it doesn't branch out enough--90% of hardcore sounds the same. Lately, though, I'm hearing a lot of hardcore bands getting pretty damn technical and doing cooler shit than most metal bands.

And lastly, Black metal is stupid for the most part. Sorry, but it is. The lyrics are retarded. The musicianship is usually shitty (it's just fast... so fucking what? Yeah... blast beats... try something new). And the vocals are terrible. Sorry, but as a vocalist myself, I must say they're just retarded. Obviously there are exceptions, but this is my general consensus on most black metal that I do hear. And I'll honestly say, I prefer hardcore.

I'm a progressive metalhead myself. I like my music technical and different (go Sikth!). I like extremes. And some of the newer hardcore that I've heard from the underground has impressed me (most still sucks, but nonetheless).

I've always considered this a site that "knows their shit", but my biggest critisism (more to the users than the reviewers) is that some people are too stuck up with being "metal", rather than simply being fans of good musicianship. Of good song writing. Of good music period. I call myself a metalhead because I find that most good music is metal. Classical is great too. :wink:

-Jaden

EDIT: Oh, and about The Haunted album. I like The Haunted, and I'll make my own judgement after I hear it.


OK here we go:

Killswitch Engage has some nice moments on the Alive or Just Breathing album, I'll admit that.

Second, Atreyu does indeed suck big, BIG time.

Third, you've obiously haven't heard almost anything of Black Metal, it is one of the best genres of metal ever, it is really variated and it has more passion in it that in most of the other ones. Also at the end of the day, it comes to taste, you can't diss Black Metal only because you don't like it. And what's that of the horrrible musicianship, just listen to Emperor for christ's sake, what you're saying is simply stupid, and I just can't get how you prefer hardcore to BM or any Metal genre out there.

Third, The Dillinger Escape Plan is an excellent band, I love Calculating Infinity, superb album.

And last I'm not stuck being "Metal", didn't you see in this thread that I listen to stuff like: The Cure, Interpol, The Blood Brothers.

Hails!!!


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Oct 17, 2004 9:37 pm 
thanks god you don't exclusively listen to black metal !!! :) i was kinda afraid you did :?

so i like Atreyu and you don't ? so what ? as it turns out we both like The Cure or Interpol and maby many more...

about Dillinger Escape Plan, you're right, they're a great band ! try their EP with Mike Patton & their last album "Miss Machine" though there are some melodic vocals on both it's still the same twisted technical chaotic metalcore... sooo good !!! :twisted:

and since you seem to enjoy intricate melodies with gloomy moods, you shoudt try the new Samaël album "Reign of Light", it's like Cure meets Rammstein with solid heavy roots... enjoy !


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Oct 17, 2004 10:24 pm 
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The Immortal Emokid wrote:
and since you seem to enjoy intricate melodies with gloomy moods, you shoudt try the new Samaël album "Reign of Light", it's like Cure meets Rammstein with solid heavy roots... enjoy !


Sounds interesting, of the new stuff I have Eternal and I think it's quite good, but I do prefer their previous works like Ceremony of Opposites, I would have prefered that the new sound was managed as a side project and not as the band, they should've done both things, anyway I'll guess I'll check the new album out. Thanx.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Oct 17, 2004 11:39 pm 
Atreyu is bad. bad bad bad, www.youhavebadtasteinmusic.com the guy should go to one of their concerts.

Secondly, I am the wizards is an asshole, and I listen to better music than him because I said so. I also bought 5 CD's this week, I am proud of myself.

Thirdly, There is no thirdly.

Killswitch engage is good, their new CD is not as good and has some stupid songs.

Iamthewizards, you're an idiot, kill yourself. You're exactly the kind of person I was a year ago, but I was 14 then. I heard someone say you're like 17? You're a joke. I used to be like, "DEATH METAL, BLACK METAL, IF IT ISNT THAT, IT SUCKS11!1!1!!!!!!!!!!" But now I realized how fucking stupid that is and you should broaden your musictal tastes, since I know you like other things, but no you have to have your, "I'm tough" image. In other words, you're an asshole who flames people because they like something other than black, and most black sucks.

And for the dude that said, "hardcore is getting technical" or whatever, never speak again. 93% of all Hardcore sucks, as stated in scientific proof magazine.


oh, and nightwish is not metal, they're just another band like evanesence which sadly was reviewed on this site, and got a 95, please explain, also explain giving slipknot a 87.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 18, 2004 12:48 am 
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Einherjar
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Slipknot got an 87 because they had matured staggeringly from their first two albums, dropped all the lame 'People=Shit' style antics, and basically produced an album that is as interesting as it is a declaration of artistic growth.

To translate: Because the new CD is good, you asshole. Give it a fair listen, and you'll be surprised at how metal it is.

At this point, the only people who can deny that Slipknot have become a metal band are those who refuse to give up a grudge, or asses like IAmTheBlackWizards.

Admittedly, though the new Slipknot album does feature songs about angst and non-specific malaise, so do many other metal albums. Gone are the lame start-stop riffs and the complete lack of emotional maturity, and in their place are excellent drumbeats, varied solos, and (for the most part) successful musical experimentation.

Am I the only one who notes the extreme irony of your last post? It's rather hilarious, if obviously unintentional.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 18, 2004 1:16 am 
Quote:
and I just can't get how you prefer hardcore to BM or any Metal genre out there


Whoa! Slow down! I never said that. I prefer almost any metal genre over hardcore.

And deathkvlt, I'm open minded, so tell me your favorite black metal song(s) and I'll give them an open minded listen.

Husker, don't diss nightwish. Listen to songs like Planet Hell, and tell me that they still don't have metal in them. Some of their songs are more operatic rock, but nonetheless, they're a band widely appreciated by the metal community. Tarja is an amazing operatic vocalist.

Quote:
And for the dude that said, "hardcore is getting technical" or whatever, never speak again. 93% of all Hardcore sucks, as stated in scientific proof magazine.


I agree. 93% of hardcore does suck. I never meant all hardcore is getting technical, I meant some. Don't fucking talk to me or anyone like that. I don't see any evidence that you even know anything about metal. You're a snob, but you don't know anything.

-Jaden


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 18, 2004 4:37 am 
Dead Machine wrote:
Slipknot got an 87 because they had matured staggeringly from their first two albums, dropped all the lame 'People=Shit' style antics, and basically produced an album that is as interesting as it is a declaration of artistic growth.

To translate: Because the new CD is good, you asshole. Give it a fair listen, and you'll be surprised at how metal it is.

At this point, the only people who can deny that Slipknot have become a metal band are those who refuse to give up a grudge, or asses like IAmTheBlackWizards.

Admittedly, though the new Slipknot album does feature songs about angst and non-specific malaise, so do many other metal albums. Gone are the lame start-stop riffs and the complete lack of emotional maturity, and in their place are excellent drumbeats, varied solos, and (for the most part) successful musical experimentation.

Am I the only one who notes the extreme irony of your last post? It's rather hilarious, if obviously unintentional.


I gave it a listen, I had it the day it came out. Maybe you should know what you're talking about before you try to flame someone?

"I push my fingers into my eyes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" That there, is maturity guyz, I mean they've really grown as musicians !111

More like they tryed to get popular by writing some emo style lyrics and having straight acoustic guitar songs, no problem in that but you can obviously tell it's a ploy to get popular, and I think they suceeded since they're on MTV and every other stupid ass radio station. I traded in their CD and deleted it off my computer a week or so ago (took me way to long to do this, lol).

And I personally liked slipknots old stuff better, not that it was anything amazing. But to give them an 87 especially on this CD is absurd. That's higher than Kamelots, The fourth legacy, higher than, Arch enemy, Anthems of rebellion, higher or tied with 3 Pantera CD's, including the great southern trendkill, which was an awsome CD. I have no idea how you can have slipknot on the same level with pantera.

3 points lower than Dream Theaters, six degrees. That's a god damn joke, for any DT CD to be in the same 20 point ratio with slipknot (especially their new CD) is hilarious.

Oh and don't tell me your same old bullshit about how they matured. No one fucking cares how much they "matured". I usually think this site has the best reviews. But rate the fucking music, not how much they matured. I don't care if they matured from 1 year olds to 2304982039480239 year olds, the new CD blew ass, and was worse than everything they've done before, which is bad, very bad.

IRONY !1!1

Quote:
I agree. 93% of hardcore does suck. I never meant all hardcore is getting technical, I meant some. Don't fucking talk to me or anyone like that. I don't see any evidence that you even know anything about metal. You're a snob, but you don't know anything.


The internet is serious guys, remember that!


Oh and I guess metallica has de-matured. laffo.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 18, 2004 5:35 am 
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Jaden wrote:
And deathkvlt, I'm open minded, so tell me your favorite black metal song(s) and I'll give them an open minded listen.


That's the true Metal spirit, I'm glad you are open minded; as I could read in your post, you're a Prog Metal-head so get yourself a copy of Emperor - Prometheus: The Principle of Fire & Demise, it's kind of Prog Black Metal, you have no idea what an excellent album that is, you'll be blown away, also check out Borknagar's Empiricism or their latest release, Epic, I garantee you'll like them.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 18, 2004 11:07 am 
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Einherjar
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Posts: 2527
Husker wrote:
I gave it a listen, I had it the day it came out. Maybe you should know what you're talking about before you try to flame someone?


Funny how you should say that.

Quote:
"I push my fingers into my eyes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" That there, is maturity guyz, I mean they've really grown as musicians !111


I'm talking about the music, you illiterate fuckhead. Listen to the music.

Admittedly, the lyrics aren't that wonderful. So what? Since when was 'Re! Spect! Walk! What did you say?' so lauded within the literary world?

Quote:
More like they tryed to get popular by writing some emo style lyrics and having straight acoustic guitar songs, no problem in that but you can obviously tell it's a ploy to get popular, and I think they suceeded since they're on MTV and every other stupid ass radio station. I traded in their CD and deleted it off my computer a week or so ago (took me way to long to do this, lol).


Since they never released the acoustic songs or the 'emo style' songs, and never mention them in press releases, artwork, the CD, or advertisements, your argument makes no sense.

Quote:
And I personally liked slipknots old stuff better, not that it was anything amazing. But to give them an 87 especially on this CD is absurd. That's higher than Kamelots, The fourth legacy, higher than, Arch enemy, Anthems of rebellion, higher or tied with 3 Pantera CD's, including the great southern trendkill, which was an awsome CD. I have no idea how you can have slipknot on the same level with pantera.


Because The Grating Southern Earkill isn't that great, maybe? It's the only substandard Pantera CD, in my opinion.

Anthems of Rebellion was nowhere near as good as Burning Bridges, and neither was Wages of Sin. The riffs are too boring, samey, and derivative to be really celebrated.

Don't listen to Kamelot, don't care about Kamelot.

Quote:
3 points lower than Dream Theaters, six degrees. That's a god damn joke, for any DT CD to be in the same 20 point ratio with slipknot (especially their new CD) is hilarious.


Dream Theater sucks. So does all prog-rock because it has no soul and is completely meaningless and masturbatory.

If you're still going through that 'Pink Floyd' phase that everyone goes through whilst they're in highschool, I suggest you haul ass out of there before you end up as a sad-sack lardo who works in a record shop.

Quote:
Oh and don't tell me your same old bullshit about how they matured. No one fucking cares how much they "matured". I usually think this site has the best reviews. But rate the fucking music, not how much they matured. I don't care if they matured from 1 year olds to 2304982039480239 year olds, the new CD blew ass, and was worse than everything they've done before, which is bad, very bad.


If you were halfway literate, then you'd know that I was referring the THE FINISHED PRODUCT. Maturity of a musician ultimately is reflected upon their MUSIC.

Quote:
IRONY !1!1


If you would like an explanation of how ironic the post was, then I'd be happy to show you, but only upon request.

Quote:
I agree. 93% of hardcore does suck. I never meant all hardcore is getting technical, I meant some. Don't fucking talk to me or anyone like that. I don't see any evidence that you even know anything about metal. You're a snob, but you don't know anything.


The internet is serious guys, remember that![/quote]

Jaden's right, Husker. You're just a snob who knows nothing. I'm not condescending to you, I'm just smarter than you, as well as more open-minded.

And you're an idiot. Pretty simple.

Quote:
Oh and I guess metallica has de-matured. laffo.


This is the only halfway intelligent thing you've said in your post.

You are unworthy of the time it took to write this post.


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 Post subject: famous last words ?
PostPosted: Mon Oct 18, 2004 3:34 pm 
the point is, and it's for everyone to accept it, that you label metal what your heart say is metal...


my metal goes from metal flavored hardcore to progressive (rock) metal à la Marillion 83/87... I tried a few black metal some adviced me about here... it's just not for me... a little black infused in something else can do the trick for me but pure black metal (progressive, brutal, technical or any sub-genres you could find) just makes me wanna listen to Atreyu :wink:

sorry guys, i started listening to metal in 1977 and Black Metal (as a major part of Death Metal) is just too much for me !!!

and I don't care if a band is hype, if they're on Headbanger's Ball or whatever crappy television show you're actually watching (since you know Atreyu are on) while i'm not...

i get all my informations on music by the web and i'm pretty happy with it !!!

Cheers !


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 18, 2004 4:27 pm 
Dead Machine wrote:
Husker wrote:
I gave it a listen, I had it the day it came out. Maybe you should know what you're talking about before you try to flame someone?


Funny how you should say that.

Quote:
"I push my fingers into my eyes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" That there, is maturity guyz, I mean they've really grown as musicians !111


I'm talking about the music, you illiterate fuckhead. Listen to the music.

Admittedly, the lyrics aren't that wonderful. So what? Since when was 'Re! Spect! Walk! What did you say?' so lauded within the literary world?

Quote:
More like they tryed to get popular by writing some emo style lyrics and having straight acoustic guitar songs, no problem in that but you can obviously tell it's a ploy to get popular, and I think they suceeded since they're on MTV and every other stupid ass radio station. I traded in their CD and deleted it off my computer a week or so ago (took me way to long to do this, lol).


Since they never released the acoustic songs or the 'emo style' songs, and never mention them in press releases, artwork, the CD, or advertisements, your argument makes no sense.

Quote:
And I personally liked slipknots old stuff better, not that it was anything amazing. But to give them an 87 especially on this CD is absurd. That's higher than Kamelots, The fourth legacy, higher than, Arch enemy, Anthems of rebellion, higher or tied with 3 Pantera CD's, including the great southern trendkill, which was an awsome CD. I have no idea how you can have slipknot on the same level with pantera.


Because The Grating Southern Earkill isn't that great, maybe? It's the only substandard Pantera CD, in my opinion.

Anthems of Rebellion was nowhere near as good as Burning Bridges, and neither was Wages of Sin. The riffs are too boring, samey, and derivative to be really celebrated.

Don't listen to Kamelot, don't care about Kamelot.

Quote:
3 points lower than Dream Theaters, six degrees. That's a god damn joke, for any DT CD to be in the same 20 point ratio with slipknot (especially their new CD) is hilarious.


Dream Theater sucks. So does all prog-rock because it has no soul and is completely meaningless and masturbatory.

If you're still going through that 'Pink Floyd' phase that everyone goes through whilst they're in highschool, I suggest you haul ass out of there before you end up as a sad-sack lardo who works in a record shop.

Quote:
Oh and don't tell me your same old bullshit about how they matured. No one fucking cares how much they "matured". I usually think this site has the best reviews. But rate the fucking music, not how much they matured. I don't care if they matured from 1 year olds to 2304982039480239 year olds, the new CD blew ass, and was worse than everything they've done before, which is bad, very bad.


If you were halfway literate, then you'd know that I was referring the THE FINISHED PRODUCT. Maturity of a musician ultimately is reflected upon their MUSIC.

Quote:
IRONY !1!1


If you would like an explanation of how ironic the post was, then I'd be happy to show you, but only upon request.

Quote:
I agree. 93% of hardcore does suck. I never meant all hardcore is getting technical, I meant some. Don't fucking talk to me or anyone like that. I don't see any evidence that you even know anything about metal. You're a snob, but you don't know anything.


The internet is serious guys, remember that!


Jaden's right, Husker. You're just a snob who knows nothing. I'm not condescending to you, I'm just smarter than you, as well as more open-minded.

And you're an idiot. Pretty simple.

Quote:
Oh and I guess metallica has de-matured. laffo.


This is the only halfway intelligent thing you've said in your post.

You are unworthy of the time it took to write this post.[/quote]


I know, I'm an idiot. Anthems of Rebellion was 10x better than volume 3.

I listened to the music, it clearly sucks. You're just another stupid "metalhead". But being "hard" and going against what other people think no matter what is cool these days? Isn't it?

I don't understand how you can say Prog sucks, when Dream theater clearly one of the greatest bands of all time. And you don't listen to Kamelot, or care about them? K.

I realize I'm unworthy because I mean I'm a snob over the internetS, I should be ashamed of myself and clean my act up.
:roll:

The fact of the matter is, you're defending slipknot heavily which is just lol worthy, and shows your amazing taste in music. All slipknot has going for them is a good drummer.

Quote:
Since they never released the acoustic songs or the 'emo style' songs, and never mention them in press releases, artwork, the CD, or advertisements, your argument makes no sense.


are you kidding? Did you even listen to the CD? Vermillion Pt. 2, I see all the little emo kids who love bright eyes listening to that song, lol, when I first heard it, I was like, "w-hat." Then some asshole was trying to get all the kids who hate slipknot to love this song and they all did....nope not trying to get popular at all. No way guys.

www.youhavebadtasteinmusic.com


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 18, 2004 8:35 pm 
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Einherjar
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Posts: 2527
What I meant by the final statement was that they did not promote the hell out of the fact that they had acoustic songs. Did you see 'Now with acoustic tracks!' on the CD lining?

Course I know they had acoustic songs. What's the big deal?

Prog sucks because all the statements made cannot be made again, and nowadays nobody can think of anything original.

Dream Theater is one of the greatest bands ever? My ass. Their music is, as I have stated, worthless, soulless, masturbatory, and basically meaningless.

Tell you what, here's a link to somebody who argues for Vol. 3's excellence better then me.

This man is smarter than you. I happen to know him.

To be honest, since neither of us can convince the other, this is just a show of e-cock size. I know I'm right, you know you're right, and we'll never agree.

So you and I can both end this stupid waste of space, and act like adults instead of children squabbling over nothing that means anything.


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 Post subject: progressive music ?
PostPosted: Mon Oct 18, 2004 8:45 pm 
i couldn't agree more on what you say about dream theatre, it's technical in a way masturbation is... i don't doubt they're excellent musicians but they never did a good album, a few good songs but that shouldn't be enough to get the popularity they have...

but you say prog sucks ? :shock: that nothing new can come out of this aged music ? did I got you right ? if it's the case I fully disagree. sure, no intersting progressive music came out of the metal scene but some bands used prog element (Iron Maiden, Deep Purple, Angra etc...) to ellighten their metal and it turned out pretty well... :)

:idea: also, there's some new progressing music that still evolves and creates new landscapes but it's never labelled metal or progressive... now they call it "post rock" or "math core", anyway, it's still in the great tradition of progressive music !

as for Slipknot i never liked them, they're too much of the "Kiss for the Korn generation" to me... but maybe I should give a try at their 3rd lp since they matured a lot you say... :shock:


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 18, 2004 10:59 pm 
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Einherjar
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Posts: 2527
Prog in itself, when applied as a secondary genre to something like, say, thrash, is good.

Pure prog is boring as fuck, far too irritating, and has lost all meaning nowadays. Back in the day, when prog still had something to say, I'm sure it was more interesting. Now... people seem to think 'progressive' means 'time changes and weird signatures.' Progressive music to me, means something that hasn't been done before, or a sound that nobody else has. Dream Theater does the same thing over and over and everyone loves them for it.

How is making the same record over and over for twelve years progressive? Jazz influence isn't progressive anymore, time signatures are everywhere, weird structure is commonplace... how is Dream Theater at all progressive, considering that?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 18, 2004 11:41 pm 
I see we're having the same thoughts about progressive music... this stuff they call progressive now is way too influenced by all the great bands from the past to be relevently labeled as progressive music..

in my humble opinion, progressive music now means working on structures and sounds to create something new or, at least, surprising... bands like Godspeed You Black Emperor !, Sigur Ros or Cheval De Frise (french duet consisting in an acoustic guitar and a drumset...) are the best breed of actual progressive rock without having ever been labeled progressive except for me and a few "indieheads" around the world...

and if you want to see what real progressive music was in the 70's, I suggest you try Van Der Graaf Generator, Magma or King Crimson... it's the real thing and it's never too mellow!

Cheers !


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 19, 2004 12:25 am 
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Einherjar
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Posts: 2527
Aight, I'll give King Crimson a spin. I've seen his records marked down at my local shop.

Thanks for the recommendation.


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