Metal Reviews

AH yes, well I dont hate something or someone. I laugh with the hatred I read (nuance).

So what? My time here is limited. Trust me.

Huh? you havent slowed your posting down yet. Its ok to admit you still love us all Ken

I've also noticed a decline in discussions round here lately. A new topic pops up rarely these days

I stick around in hopes that there will be some quality music discussion going on. That's why I come here.

Once my site is ready, I'm out.

You're starting a gay porn site

What you gonna do with your site? Is it a forum you made?

No. A review site.

How much you wanna bet you will still come here anyways?

A Million dollars!!!!

I'll always be a fan of this site.

The same amount I bet on Zad coming back. They're both sure things.

what i don't get is, you always complain about certain members of this board, a big part of the members even, however, this board still seems pretty important to you, because why would you else care that the forum was dead.

I think there is a handful of people on this forum that ruin. I do. But I also like quite a few people here, so I come back. Like I said earier, I stick around in hopes that there will be some quality music discussion going on. It's not a discussion forum these days, it's a chatroom first and foremost. Hellheim is the most active forum here, and those other threads that do get a lot of replies are usually filled with negative nonsense.

But yes, I do "care" about this forum, so to speak, but at the moment I don't really enjoy it. And I'm not the only one. I'm the only one that'll say it outside of a PM.

true, i have never hidden the fact that i visit this forum less than i used to because the quality of this forum has took a downfall. However, i would have never known about a shitload of great music without this forum. So i still visit/post here, pure out of musical interest and sometimes for the laughs.

I think that a large part of the problem is that when we do have musical discussions, they quickly turn into ad hominem arguments that end up as pissing contests, and its impossible to have a good debate in an enviornment like that. I'm not blaming anyone in particular for this (most of us seem to contribute in one way or another). However, the black metal thread going on right now does show that we can have good discussions here still (unfortunately, I can't join in because I know nothing about black metal). Another thing is obviously that we lack many of old posters; I was looking over the top 30 today and noticed that only about 10 of them post consistently these days. The result of this is that we have one or two people each who specialize in one type of metal; so, for example, its impossible for there to be a good thrash thread about a lesser known band, because there will only be a few people who've heard of them. We need more posters, and more importantly, we need to learn how to argue without being overly defensive and attacking the people we argue with. Thats my two cents. I personally still find the forum to be fun, and enjoy posting here.

Which is exactly why I'm not posting in that thread. One of the biggest problems, though, is that far too many people do the opposite, they inject their "opinions" into topics they know nothing about. Music discussion is hardly ever going to be anything but "ad hominem arguments," that's what they are, that's what they'll always be. The problem is keeping it civil, that is the hard part, and that isn't helped when someone comes along and drops some worthless shitbomb on a subject they know nothing about. Then if you go against that person, his little e-buddies jump in to stand up for him.

We all know what would happen if I went into the black metal thread and said "black metal sucks." Yet those kinds of comments are posted constantly across this forum and no one says a word because it's always stuff like "nu-metal sucks" or "In Flames sucks" or whatever. But honestly, what's the basic difference? There isn't a difference. The effect is the same.

At least I do my best to avoid topics of which I know nothing.

I think part of the problem is that we're in a slow part of the year, in terms of major releases. Things will pickup in a few months.

I disagree with you on several points. Firstly, although it is different in this case because the thread is about the black metal scene and how its changed and therefore going in there to say that you don't like black metal is irrelevant, a general thread about a band or a genre is different. Obviously, just saying "Band X sucks" and then leaving isn't useful, but people coming into threads and offering constructive criticism on bands, or at least saying why they don't like them, is indeed part of the discussion process- otherwise we all just agree that the band rules and it can get kind of boring. I'd say the problem is both people just saying "band x sucks" instead of going into why they think they suck and also in people being overly defensive about criticism of things they like; if someone comes into a thread and says that "band x sucks," people can just ignore it instead of it developing into a flamewar; or, if someone offers criticism and argues a point, a defender of the band can try to rebut those points.

And I also disagree that music discussions are nothing more than ad hominem arguments. Because music is very subjective, it often seems that way, but it is very easy to have an argument with someone over say, whether band x is better than band y, without resorting to "well your opinion is stupid or irrelevant" or "you suck, so your opinion does too!" Example:

Person 1: I like Kreator's Coma of Souls better than Pleasure to Kill. The song structures are more coherent, the riffs are more distinctly thrash metal instead of death/thrash, and Mille's vocals are better.

Person 2: But the death/thrash adds to a sense of darkness that Coma of Souls lacks. The lack of coherency in song structure adds to the albums charm; this is thrash, not Beethoven, and thrash music thrives on not being coherent. Also, Mille's vocals are more aggressive and suit the music better, etc...

Or:

Person 1: Darkness Descends is a horrible album. Dark Angel can play fast, but they only play at one speed, and the riffs blend into each other after a while, and each song sounds the same. The singer's screechiness is really annoying.

Person two: Thrash is supposed to be played fast. Although the riffs appear similar, on closer listening most are rather distinct, and the songs themselves have distinct structures. And the vocals work exactly because they're over the top and screechy; when the chorus of Darkness Descends come along, you've got to headbang, drink a beer, and screech out as loud as you can right along with him.

Debates don't obviously need to be as polite as this. But it certainly is possible to have musical discussion without resorting to name calling. Otherwise music literature class discussions would just be people calling each other idiots.

Edit: Kuurus also has a point. There haven't been many major releases at all so far- wait till the new Kamelot comes out, new Shadows Fall (this tuesday, I believe), new W.A.S.P., etc.. all come out.