Metal Reviews

@FS

I thought we talked through this in PMs, dude...

If you are trying to compare two belief systems, both thousands of years old, both with long track records of violence and oppression, then contemporary differences between them have to be explained in terms of external factors. You can't just explain the fact that Islam is worse now because it's Islam, full stop, given the centuries of history in which that same religion has been more "progressive" than Christianity was in Europe.

I guess you could try and bring in some liberal philosophical angle into it about European Christianity went through some kind of "Enlightenment" which modernised it, and Islam didn't, but then you have to explain various things.

a) Why is radical Islam a "bottom up" movement? i.e. why are the people most enthusiastic about it frequently poorer, or more politically oppressed people living in extremely unstable environments (i.e. Hamas' support base in Palestine or the revolutionary movement in Iran '79). This was never the case with the oppressive Christian fundamentalism in days of yore, which was administered by a clerical elite and imposed upon the plebs from above. When has there ever been a Christian revolution? Some gentile liberal "enlightenment" doesn't even begin to explain these phenomena.

b) Why is this a comparatively recent phenomenon? Movements like Hamas getting into power democratically were unthinkable, before it actually happened. A movement like Iran '79 was unthinkable, until it actually happened. Something had to make it happen, and looking for something inherent to Islam itself is simply not enough.

c) Why do people who have grown up in a secular, "enlightened" country still turn to radical Islam? They are not indoctrinated by there parents, because if you read books like The Islamist you will know that the kids that turn to Islamic radicalism often look on their parents with disdain for being too moderate and tolerant. Depicting the mosque or the Koran as simply being a bad influence, guiding them away from the loveliness of the democratic societies they grew up in is not enough, either. Their parents read these books just as much as they did.

The answer is obvious: It is about politics. Or, in the immortal words of Skunk Anansie, "yes, it's fucking political... everything's political".

And, of course, economics, but then that is a function of politics.

@Soul Society

But if the "vast majority" of the Arab world is a fundie ready to kill to defend their religion, surely resources should be no problem whatsoever, right?

And yes, Maiden haven't played Saudi, because of the government there. Government, not the people, many of which I'm sure would love to see Maiden playing Riyadh.

http://www.metal-archives.com/browseC.php?c=186

Look, can't you just acknowledge that your original statement:



was really stupid and ignorant, and then we can move on?

Yeah we did. I'm just saying that measures need to be taken to prevent the spread of Islam, I'm not saying it's inherently worse than any other religion. It just causes more deaths today, that's all.

Invade their countries and convert them to Christianity, huh.

No. Just speak out against violence, criticize belief systems that have damaging effects, and don't let them build minarets in other countries. Imagine if someone tried building a Church in Iran.

Yeah, imagine.

3 in the whole country? Wow.

So your solution is that we should become as religiously authoritarian as Iran. Because you know, if we let them build more of those gosh darned mosques and minarets they'll just never stop blowing stuff up! Are you serious, man?

No, I just don't think we should allow the religion to expand. Of course, were it up to me, I wouldn't want any sort of religious buildings.

Holy Apostolic Catholic Assyrian Church of the East

should be a band name

But there's a lot religious buildings of a lot of different religions. If we don't let build mosques and let build other religious buildings, we'll make muslim people (moderated ones included) upset, offended and more proned to fanatism.

I'm for a pure secular educational system, and a good control of any religious center. But without legal differences between religions (well, of course muslim mosques has to be more controlled by current situation).

rio, those bands are in the vast minority, I mean, shit, in Malta we have a little over double that amount of metal bands and besides the fact that Roman Catholicism is a very dominant force in Maltese culture, the population here is only a little over 400, 000.

The truth is that if the government was the only problem, there would be FAR more bands than that, especially in a country with more than 25 million people in it.

You stop terrorism by educating people and teaching them how to read. The majority of suicide bombers come from extremely poor areas with low literacy rates. You know why that is kids?

Because if you can't read, then you can't even read the Koran for yourself, and therefore can't interpret it for yourself. So you depend on a fanatic fuckwit to come to the village and preach the Koran to you. Of course he's not giving you the real version of it, but a twisted up version that fits his own agenda. He tells you being a holy martyr will please Allah, and that you'll be rewarded in the afterlife. To ice the cake, he promises to take care of your starving family financially.
So of course they fall into his trap and go blow themselves up.

Education is always the right answer folks.

Every single person involved in the 9/11 attacks and the British bombings was a middle-class citizen with European education. It wasn't ignorance, it was religious belief.

Why hate the foreigners who ruin your country when you can oppose the leftist multiculture loving fools who invite them? Is it not better to prevent than to mend?

We don't have "multiculturalists" here. Even the hippies don't want foreigners.

Neoliberals then, or whatever have you. Even the 'regular' liberals are probably for inviting more and more North-African immigrants, but for economic instead of socio-cultural reasons obviously. But they fall into the leftist category as well, per definition.

If no one wants foreigners in your country, then what are you guys waiting for? Hampered by the 'fearful white man syndrom'? You guys have all that Holohoax money on bank accounts, use it for something good for a change!

Malta is a European country... Europe being pretty much the place where metal is most popular.

There are only twice as many in Egypt, with a secular government, closer cultural ties to the West and over three times as many people.

There are only six more in Lebanon, a multicultural country with much, much stronger cultural ties to the West, although admittedly a much smaller population.

There are less than half as many in Syria, a secular country with almost the same population.

Let's be honest, you're really in no position to be telling anyone else what ordinary Arabs think, are you? You have your assumptions that they must all be religious nuts, but you have pretty much nothing to back that up.

And feminism!

more like fEMOnism

Have to stop Obama from messing up our bank secrecy first.

Anyway, the worst (or best, depending on your point of view) we have here are socialists who want to decrease restrictions on immigration and offer even more to refugees. Not to say we shouldn't help them, but come on, our country's tiny.